Today’s guest is retired journalist,

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Wahoo,

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Nebraska historian,

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and not my real uncle,

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Uncle Bob Copperstone.

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All right, you ready for this?

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Ready as I’ll ever be.

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Okay, so the idea behind this podcast is to convince people that they’re interesting.

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Do you need to be convinced that you’re interesting?

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I feel like you probably already know that.

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What makes you interesting?

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Oh, hell, I earned it.

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How’d you earn it?

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By being interesting for so long.

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Okay.

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When did you first start being interesting?

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I never stopped.

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You were born that way?

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I was born that way.

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All right.

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So you’re born in Wahoo, right?

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Isn’t everybody?

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Oh, I guess I was wrong.

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Everybody that matters, huh?

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That’s true.

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All right.

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So here’s the list.

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I made a list of things that I knew about you.

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So you’re born in Wahoo.

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You helped run the family-owned Wigwam Cafe as a kid.

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At some point, you moved to California, and you became a newspaper reporter.

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You’re married at some point, I think.

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You don’t really talk about it to me.

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And then at some point you drove a truck cross-country picking up antiques.

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You told me that once.

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And then you moved back to Wahoo to retire.

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Was that about right?

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That’s about right.

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Okay.

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Why did you decide to become a reporter then?

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Ever since I was in high school, I was a bad student.

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Mediocre Ds and Cs.

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And I thought,

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well,

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at one of the classes,

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a civics class,

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the teacher asked us what we want to do when we get elderly.

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And I thought, well, I want to be a reporter.

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Well, that goes back quite a way.

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Did you know any reporters?

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Why did you tell her you wanted to be one?

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Well, wasn’t Clark Kent a reporter?

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So you saw a little Superman in yourself?

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Probably.

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At least a close friend.

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Anyhow,

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I started,

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when I went to California,

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or before I went to California,

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I worked at the Bellevue Press.

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right after graduation and I had that in front of me and I worked in a print shop,

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a newspaper print shop here in Wahoo and in Bellevue.

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And in Bellevue they let me work,

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they let me interview a guy who lived in a trailer court and had a thousand

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Tropical Fish in it and then their name was Trout.

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And so I made a little story out of that and they printed it on the front page.

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Since I was working on the press,

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the big cylinder press that printed the paper,

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I was able to print my own first,

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my first byline.

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I both wrote it and printed it.

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And I still have that.

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Anyhow,

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I started with the newspapers there,

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then I went to California after a year in Bellevue.

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I had gotten a Triumph TR3 sports car, an English sports car, and I drove that to California.

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I mailed the passenger seat ahead of time and put all my belongings on that spot.

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I drove to California.

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Got a job at a print shop there.

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While I was looking for work, I didn’t know how to type.

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And I asked the managing editor of the paper that I wanted to work at.

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He says, fill this out.

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And I said, can I use, can I write?

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Can I fill it out with a written one?

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And he says, yeah.

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But, of course, I didn’t get that job.

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What made you want to go to California?

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Why didn’t you just get a job closer to Nebraska?

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Well,

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I did work as a printer’s devil at the Wahoo newspaper in the print shop when I was

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still in high school.

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When I worked in Bellevue, I lived in a flop house on 13th Street in Omaha.

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And I had my time off tier 3 then.

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And I spent one winter in Omaha driving through that little sports car,

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trying to drive that through the snow.

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This ain’t for me.

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California calls.

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Took off between snowstorms.

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I drove as far south as I could to get out of that blizzard and carried it all the

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way to California.

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In your sports car?

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Yeah.

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Did you have a job then or you just decided to get out of the winter?

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I stayed with my aunt and uncle.

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They lived there since the 40s and that was my shelter.

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Did you get a job after you moved or did you have a job lined up already?

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No, I went job searching.

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I ended up at a print shop in San Gabriel that printed wedding invitations and so

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forth and that carried me through for about a year.

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And I decided to, I wasn’t making it at that print shop.

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I wasn’t making enough money.

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So I quit there and decided, my cousins were fuller brushmen.

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And I became a fuller brushman.

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Of the door-to-door salesman?

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Selling brushes?

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Selling brushes.

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Were you good at it?

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Well, I went from door to door.

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I didn’t, I was too shy to meet people.

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I’d go door to door.

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I’d say, nobody home, I hope, I hope.

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You’d mutter that to yourself?

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I’d mutter that and then plow it on through.

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And if I got somebody’s attention,

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I just held them there with,

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practically grabbed them by the collar and told them to listen to what I have to

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say.

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And I didn’t do well at all.

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I drove back to Wahoo.

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What was your pitch to sell fuller brushes?

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They last for a good long time.

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Did they?

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Whatever they’re looking at, that’ll last for a good long time.

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Somehow I thought that would be magic, but it didn’t work.

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It’s, uh...

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So I went back to Wahoo.

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So you went to, you’re a fuller brush salesman in California, you went back to Wahoo after that?

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Mm-hmm.

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Okay.

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Yeah, I was kind of discouraged.

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Oh, I was going to go to school.

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Okay.

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And I did.

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Okay.

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I went to the University of Nebraska.

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Back to Lincoln, went to school.

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Oh, when I came back from California, oh, I took, taking classes by mail.

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From California?

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No, from Wahoo.

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Did you ever actually go to class in Lincoln?

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Or was it all by mail?

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Yeah, I did.

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I took French class about a semester.

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There was a print shop course.

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Okay.

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It was in the basement of one of the buildings there.

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And I really took to the print shop work, type of work.

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I did that real well.

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So I thought well I’ll quit my job here but my grades were falling real bad at the university.

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That’s when I went to Bellevue.

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I was doing real well at the print shop there at the university that I thought I’d

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get a job doing the same thing and get paid for it.

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So I worked for the Bellevue Press for about a year and decided I’d go back to

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California and look for a job.

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All right.

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So you grew up in Wahoo.

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You went to California, became a fuller brush salesman, came back.

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Went to school,

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got a job,

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took a bunch of classes and got a job in Bellevue,

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and then you decided to go back to California in order to get a reporting job,

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a newspaper job.

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And I did.

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I told the editor there, I’ll work for a dollar an hour.

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Yeah.

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And they hired me and liked it.

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As a reporter?

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As a reporter, yeah.

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I had my own paper, a little weekly paper.

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I went to a city council meeting, my first one.

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That was part of the job.

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You keep track of what the city is doing.

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And Covina is a town of about $50,000, something like that.

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That’s small in Los Angeles County.

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I went there and listened to the little discussions.

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Went back the next day.

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Wednesday was press day.

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And I sat at my desk and Jim, the managing editor, he said, well, Bob, let’s have your story.

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I sat there and I sat there.

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Dune came and went.

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Jim finally says, Bob, where’s your story?

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I said, Jim, I don’t know what happened.

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I thought, well, that’s the end of Bob.

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Jim laughed.

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Didn’t know what happened with your story?

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No, I didn’t know what happened so I could write about it.

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I didn’t know how to write it.

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Nothing happened of note at the city council meeting.

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Apparently.

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I knew what happened.

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I didn’t know how to put it to words.

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Jim kind of chuckled.

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And he got on the phone to the city administrator and said, hey, Joe, what happened last night?

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And Jim wrote the story for me.

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Did he give you credit?

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Did he say it was written by you?

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No, no, no.

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Okay.

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But that was the last time Jim had to write my story.

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I went to the next one.

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I went to the library where there were three papers covering it.

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And I read what they wrote and got this hang of it and was able to write my own

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stories after that.

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So you went and you read what other people wrote about the thing that you were

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supposed to cover?

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Yes, I read Jim’s story and Farewell is the House Done and I learned from that.

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All the time learning how to type.

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Yeah.

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But it worked.

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On a manual typewriter?

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What was that process?

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You had a manual typewriter and then you... You turn the copy into the back shop.

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They read it.

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They put it on a line of type.

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Cast the lead type.

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And put that lead type on a...

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Printing Press and Print Your Paper.

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Is it just one at a time, every letter at a time, or how do they cast it?

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No, no, no.

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They read my copy and type it out on the linotype.

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There’s a separate machine that you type it into?

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No, the linotype does.

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Yeah, yeah.

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A different person does?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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I turn in the paper to the back shop.

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I turn in my paper to the back shop.

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and story to the back shop and they put it down to type and print it.

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So a linotype machine,

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that was what you learned how to use and what you did in Bellevue or is that

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something else?

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No, my work stopped there.

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The reporters don’t do the linotype.

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But you did when you were in Bellevue, so you did your own?

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No, I typed my own.

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Okay.

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No, I typed

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When you were a typesetter, didn’t you say you did that before too?

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Before it?

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Oh, I see what you’re getting at.

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No, I never did that.

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I never had to work the back shot.

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I never had to print the paper myself as a reporter.

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Okay.

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Well,

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it gets a little more complicated because I ran a Ludlow,

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which Ludlow Press,

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Ludlow typesetter,

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which printed the fancy type.

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Okay.

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A larger type that wouldn’t fit on a line of type.

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So what was your next big story?

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So were you still covering city council meetings after that?

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Yeah, you do everything that you expect a little weekly paper to use, yeah.

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And sometimes it’s interesting, sometimes it’s not.

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How long ago were you at that newspaper?

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Actually,

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the Monrovia Daily News,

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or Monrovia was another paper in that San Gabriel Valley area,

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and they hired me as a reporter after that,

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the one that I had to learn on.

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And from there, that was a small daily report.

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And eventually the San Gibe Valley Daily Tribune,

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which was nearing 100,000 circulation daily,

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that was a big paper.

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And they lifted me out of Monrovia and the next step up was the Tribune.

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And I rose to the assistant city editor of that paper before I retired.

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And that was the last paper you were at?

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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So what was your duties like as the assistant city editor?

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They had a staff of about 20.

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And five photographers.

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And I was responsible for looking first at the copy that came through those

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reporters and pass it on to the next editor.

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Do you have any stories you remember that you had

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Were some of your favorites?

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Oh, excuse me, yes.

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I worked as a reporter for about five years.

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Then I was an editor.

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Yeah, I had some good stories when I was a reporter.

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I had a humorous vein sometimes.

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And I had my own political...

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Political writer, editor, writer for a couple of years.

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Any stick out?

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What was one that you remember that you thought was good?

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I was supposed to go to the hotel where Bobby Kennedy was murdered.

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I was supposed to go to that lay in Los Angeles when I was editor of the political

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editor,

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but I couldn’t make it and missed it,

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so I missed it.

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Writing an obituary for that.

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Really?

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Do you remember why you missed it?

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I didn’t want to go.

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Okay.

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I didn’t want to drive to Los Angeles.

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So you found an excuse to get out of it, huh?

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Get out of it.

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Foolish man.

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So what made you want to go back to Oahu?

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Why didn’t you stay in California?

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My mother was not well, and I was about ready to retire.

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And you’ve been living in Oahu ever since then?

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Yeah.

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California never was home to me.

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Now my sister Rochelle

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And my little sister Janie both moved to California too.

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Janie died pretty much early in life, bless her heart.

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But Rochelle is still there to this day and that’s home to her.

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She got married and raised a family.

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I got married and got a divorce.

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And so I never set any roots at that point.

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I should probably clarify you’re not actually my uncle.

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So whose uncle are you?

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Everybody calls you Uncle Bob.

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Rochelle and Janie, my sisters.

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My niece and my two nieces, Kathy and Tina, are Janie’s children.

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Actually, to my neighbors, I’m Uncle Bob.

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Yeah?

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Everybody, even your neighbors call you Uncle Bob?

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Some do, yeah.

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Yeah?

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Yep.

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Kind of trips off the tongue.

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Yeah?

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Yeah.

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And I’m so damn lovable.

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Yeah.

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You might as well be everyone’s uncle.

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That’s true.

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Why not?

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It doesn’t cost anything.

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Yeah.

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My kids are always,

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they call you Uncle Bob and they try to figure out how you’re related to them too.

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Oh, is that right?

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Yes, it hurts.

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Yeah, that could be kind of, that could be kind of

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So why do you why do you write so much about the wigwam cafe and your childhood

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what is It’s for some reason I can’t remember what I had for breakfast But I can

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remember when I was five years old.

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I was first day in kindergarten And it just comes to be natural.

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Yeah

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It’s just,

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I mean,

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down to the,

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what I was smelling when I first walked outdoors kind of remembrance.

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It just comes back.

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And if I’m not exactly on cue, I’m absolutely correct.

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There’s nobody who’s gonna correct me.

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I can be Superman’s uncle

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Nobody would doubt it.

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Nobody would doubt if you’re Superman’s uncle?

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That’s true.

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I won’t challenge you on it.

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You could bring up figures and dates, but it wouldn’t help me.

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How much has Wahoo changed since those times?

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Has it changed a lot or not by much?

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Just about what you’d expect.

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Missing some of the good stuff, God knows.

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But it weren’t all that good.

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Everybody lives a life that looks better from a distance.

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Yeah.

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I’m one of them.

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Your life looks better from a distance?

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It’s, well, I’m different from what I was, so so am I.

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So you would say Wahoo’s changed a little bit,

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but at the end of the day,

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it’s still got a lot of the same things or a lot different?

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I mean,

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you chose to retire and live here the rest of your life,

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even after seeing the glamour of Hollywood and California.

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Well,

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I tell you,

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I miss more than that,

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because I can entertain myself just about anywhere,

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but more than that,

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I miss the people.

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Of Wahoo?

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Yeah.

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What do you like about the people of Wahoo?

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Not much.

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You want to change your answer then?

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I wonder about that.

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Actually, life is the further away from it, the better and the milder it becomes.

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Well, you have anything else you want to... We’ve been going for about a half hour.

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That’s pretty good.

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Anything else you feel like... Any wisdom you want to impart to the world?

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Any thoughts about... Oh, God, don’t follow me.

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Don’t follow you?

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You can do better.

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No, I... Wahoo people have a sense of humor.

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And I was born with it and I kept it.

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I think I owe it to a lot of the people I grew up with who treated me mildly and decently.

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Bless their hearts.

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I hope to have a worthwhile

(00:23:10):

lifetime.

(00:23:13):

Sometimes when I wasn’t as human as I thought I should be, I forgive myself.

(00:23:24):

I did the best I could.

(00:23:25):

We all do the best we can.

(00:23:28):

And what they do in Wahoo is pretty damn good.

(00:23:34):

But the damn weather.

(00:23:37):

Curse that weather.

(00:23:41):

California’s got them beat on that, huh?

(00:23:43):

Oh my gosh.

(00:23:47):

I wonder what the heck I’m doing here sometimes when the snow flies.

(00:23:55):

I always did.

(00:23:56):

Now my dad was the, I don’t know why I didn’t inherit more of his.

(00:24:06):

He was born to be an Eskimo and missed his calling.

(00:24:11):

I was on the back end.

(00:24:15):

I was a child at the time.

(00:24:17):

I was riding in the back end of his 1947 Harley Davidson Hill Climber motorcycle.

(00:24:30):

And it didn’t even have a,

(00:24:31):

it had a little small shield,

(00:24:34):

windshield on the driver’s benefit up front.

(00:24:40):

But his arms were stretched out, bare arms, I might add.

(00:24:46):

It was wintertime.

(00:24:48):

Bare arms.

(00:24:49):

And I said, Dad, I’m freezing back here.

(00:24:55):

Aren’t you cold?

(00:24:56):

He said, no, no, no, I’m not cold.

(00:24:59):

Your arms are out there in the wind.

(00:25:03):

No, no, feel them.

(00:25:05):

Warm as toast.

(00:25:07):

In the wind.

(00:25:08):

In the wintertime.

(00:25:10):

Bless his heart.

(00:25:12):

So you didn’t inherit that from him?

(00:25:16):

I wish I had inherited his Harley.

(00:25:19):

You wish you inherited his Harley?

(00:25:20):

Yeah, I wish I had.

(00:25:22):

Later he had a real knucklehead full size.

(00:25:28):

Boy oh that the hill climber though that I was on the back of that’s a little

(00:25:37):

leather pad leather stuffed pad on that fender and that was designed for the hill

(00:25:45):

climber driver rider driver I guess to sit his butt back there and put the weight

(00:25:53):

on the

(00:25:56):

Powered Rear Wheel.

(00:25:59):

Well, I sat on that.

(00:26:00):

I was about 10 or 11, God knows.

(00:26:03):

And we were going to a hill climber at Morse Bluff.

(00:26:10):

This was in about 1949, I guess.

(00:26:13):

And he had to stop every mile or so on the bumpy country road

(00:26:23):

So my kidneys would stop aching.

(00:26:27):

I was bawling back there.

(00:26:30):

And we never could make a straight line to it because it wasn’t hell on wheels.

(00:26:38):

There wasn’t much of a suspension on it?

(00:26:41):

It was a hard tail.

(00:26:46):

None of that sissy stuff for us.

(00:26:48):

God knows I wanted it.

(00:26:55):

Didn’t you say he made like a special pad just for you to sit on on that bike?

(00:26:59):

No, that’s what that hill climber did.

(00:27:03):

That was its purpose.

(00:27:06):

A hill climber.

(00:27:07):

They had contests at Morse Bluff in this case.

(00:27:12):

And they’d all try to get up to the top of the hill without falling on their tail.

(00:27:21):

It was a contest.

(00:27:23):

I thought you told a story once that your dad had a special seat that you sat on

(00:27:27):

the back of his seat.

(00:27:29):

No, that was the seat I was talking about.

(00:27:31):

That was not meant for passengers, but it was designed for it.

(00:27:42):

Actually, Dad had bought that hillclamber from my cousin, my elder cousin,

(00:27:53):

He dumped it and never got back on it.

(00:27:58):

They were designed to be fallen upon and served a purpose well.

(00:28:06):

Designed to be fallen on?

(00:28:10):

To be dumped.

(00:28:11):

Oh, to be dumped.

(00:28:13):

No, the purpose of the hill climb was to stay on without getting dumped.

(00:28:18):

If you do, you get back on.

(00:28:20):

Okay.

(00:28:22):

So they’re meant to take a lot of abuse then?

(00:28:25):

Yeah, they were abusive, that’s a fact.

(00:28:30):

When’s the last time you were on a motorcycle?

(00:28:33):

I bought one of my own.

(00:28:34):

I bought a Suzuki when I was in California.

(00:28:38):

We rode that all over California.

(00:28:41):

I loved it.

(00:28:43):

Well, any parting thoughts or wisdom or anything else?

(00:28:48):

Oh, Lordy.

(00:28:55):

Yeah, brother, can you spare a dime?

(00:28:57):

A dime won’t get you much anymore.

(00:29:01):

Hey, baby, you might give it what you can.

(00:29:04):

You need to adjust your phrases for inflation there.

(00:29:08):

Brother, can you spare a 10-spot?

(00:29:10):

I’ll spare you a dime, that’s easy.

(00:29:13):

No, that’s not easy, I don’t have one.

(00:29:15):

You could have found something in my center console in my car over lunch.

(00:29:22):

I said I could have given you a whole bunch of dimes out of the center console of

(00:29:25):

my car when we were getting lunch earlier.

(00:29:30):

What would you do with the dime if I gave you one?

(00:29:34):

Probably tighten a screw.

(00:29:39):

Maybe I ought to get you a screwdriver.

(00:29:41):

No, no, no, this will work fine.

(00:29:44):

Haven’t you ever done that?

(00:29:45):

I mean, I’m...

(00:29:48):

I’m sure I have at some point in my life.

(00:29:50):

No, you can’t use a credit card either.

(00:29:54):

I tried that once and it broke.

(00:29:55):

The credit card broke?

(00:29:56):

Yeah.

(00:29:57):

Oh, no.

(00:29:58):

What kind of screws do you need?

(00:30:00):

How many screws do you need tightened?

(00:30:04):

Counting my brain?

(00:30:05):

Yeah, it seems like you got a few screws loose.

(00:30:07):

I think your screw is loose.

(00:30:12):

I’m good.

(00:30:13):

All right, let’s wrap this up.

(00:30:15):

Thanks, Bob.

(00:30:15):

I don’t know how to wrap up an interview, but you were the first one.

(00:30:19):

How’d it go?

(00:30:20):

Well, listen, I wish I could do better, but I was glad to try.

(00:30:26):

You did great.

(00:30:30):

All right, I’m going to turn this thing off.

(00:30:34):

Interesting People is produced by Chris Beaty in his basement.

(00:30:39):

And today’s episode was recorded in Uncle Bob’s recliner in his Wahoo, Nebraska living room.

(00:30:45):

If you want to hear more of Uncle Bob’s stories,

(00:30:48):

check out the As Told by Uncle Bob podcast episodes from the As Told by C.S.

(00:30:53):

Beaty podcast universe.

(00:30:55):

Please subscribe and tell all your friends about my interesting friends.

(00:30:59):

And if you have interesting friends, well, let me know so I can talk to them.

(00:31:04):

Signing off from the greatest city on earth, Omaha, Nebraska.

Today’s guest is the guy who designed my book,

(00:00:33):

was in a band with me,

(00:00:35):

and sold me this podcast gear.

(00:00:37):

Author and artist, Ben Looters.

(00:00:42):

I don’t.

(00:00:42):

I bought this stuff from you and it took us two hours to do it and we didn’t make

(00:00:46):

it any farther.

(00:00:47):

And that was the story of the worst podcast purchase I’ve ever made.

(00:00:53):

Is this on?

(00:00:53):

Are you recording right now?

(00:00:54):

I am.

(00:00:55):

I mean, this may not make it to the end.

(00:00:56):

I got this magic audacity feature where for the next seven hours you can

(00:01:00):

individually cut certain things and change it and delete it.

(00:01:04):

It takes a really long time and it doesn’t turn out very well, but it’s awesome.

(00:01:09):

Oh man, I want to make sure I’m not like way over here like Bob.

(00:01:12):

Well, just like, should we put you in a rocking chair?

(00:01:14):

Because that’s how he did it.

(00:01:15):

Oh dude, that does sound good.

(00:01:17):

Yeah, he loved it.

(00:01:18):

When was the time you felt like a loser?

(00:01:21):

I didn’t

(00:01:39):

But I got a lot of matted fur cut out of my dog for that.

(00:01:43):

Well, hey, any time, bro.

(00:01:46):

Is that what it takes?

(00:01:47):

That’s the kind of show this is, just so you know.

(00:01:50):

It’s also the show that I’m getting really hot in this sweatshirt, so I’m going to take it off.

(00:01:54):

Oh, man.

(00:01:54):

I feel like this is why it needs to be a video podcast.

(00:01:57):

It is.

(00:01:57):

Every five minutes, Chris takes off another piece of clothing.

(00:02:01):

I reveal another tattoo.

(00:02:04):

Is that the only tattoo you... No, I got many.

(00:02:09):

You actually?

(00:02:09):

Yeah, you want me to do a naked podcast?

(00:02:12):

Is this going to be like the strip poker version of podcasts?

(00:02:15):

The thing about you,

(00:02:16):

Chris,

(00:02:17):

is like,

(00:02:17):

I think I know you really well,

(00:02:19):

but I don’t know you well enough to know sometimes when you’re joking and when

(00:02:23):

you’re not.

(00:02:24):

I never tell a lie.

(00:02:26):

That’s true.

(00:02:27):

I’m usually very odd.

(00:02:28):

I usually just try to frame things that makes you wonder if I’m telling the truth.

(00:02:31):

I think you say things that I hope you’re lying.

(00:02:34):

Yeah, they’re almost always true.

(00:02:36):

Yes, I have additional tattoos.

(00:02:39):

Would you like to see them?

(00:02:40):

Here’s one.

(00:02:41):

Oh, sure.

(00:02:41):

Here’s this one.

(00:02:42):

You should recognize this one.

(00:02:44):

Oh, that’s beautiful.

(00:02:46):

That’s the asterisk that I designed on the cover of your book.

(00:02:50):

I already told you that one’s below the belt.

(00:02:52):

No,

(00:02:52):

this is the tattoo from my wedding reception that you were at that apparently you

(00:02:57):

didn’t pay very good attention to.

(00:02:59):

Not enough to get it tattooed.

(00:03:01):

I have the arbitrary Greek tattoo that says,

(00:03:05):

hey,

(00:03:05):

this isn’t Greek and I don’t know what it means,

(00:03:07):

but it’s not Chinese,

(00:03:08):

so it’s trendier.

(00:03:10):

And then I have on my back, I have That one’s harder to do.

(00:03:14):

I can come over there and undress you a little bit.

(00:03:17):

It’s going to be hard to get on this mic here.

(00:03:20):

That one’s got cocaine leaves on it.

(00:03:24):

That’s the seal of where my kids were born.

(00:03:26):

And literally the outskirt of it, this is another, is he telling the truth?

(00:03:29):

It’s cocaine leaves.

(00:03:31):

Is it actually?

(00:03:31):

Yeah, coca leaves, not cocaine.

(00:03:33):

Oh, it’s because of Coca-Cola.

(00:03:35):

They’re big fans of Coca-Cola and Tuluwa.

(00:03:38):

Yeah, Tuluwa.

(00:03:39):

Do they make you get that when you adopt someone from there?

(00:03:42):

It’s part of the process.

(00:03:43):

It’s paperwork.

(00:03:44):

That’s why it takes so long.

(00:03:45):

Stand in line for your tattoo.

(00:03:47):

Yeah.

(00:03:47):

Yeah everyone’s got a good tattoo we adopted three kids so all of them have the matching tattoo

(00:03:52):

Make sure you’re a bad parent by getting a tattoo right away.

(00:03:57):

Literally,

(00:03:57):

I waited to get this tattoo until after the kids were adopted because I had this,

(00:04:01):

we were watching it,

(00:04:02):

my kids were adopted from Columbia,

(00:04:03):

so we had watched a lot of Narcos before we went,

(00:04:06):

which is all about- Is that required viewing?

(00:04:08):

Yeah, that’s another part of the problem.

(00:04:10):

That’s also why it takes so long because there’s a lot of seasons to get through.

(00:04:12):

And I literally thought through my head,

(00:04:14):

because you know they have gang tattoos and I’ve always heard people,

(00:04:17):

maybe not always,

(00:04:17):

I’ve heard that people will get gang tattoos and they’ll be like,

(00:04:21):

you don’t have a gang tattoo then they get like I don’t know what kind of show this

(00:04:24):

they get their ass kicked I don’t know what my level of if I’m gonna do the e or

(00:04:27):

not on this podcast we didn’t swear with Bob I think oh I’ve heard these stories

(00:04:32):

they like get their ass kicked for having like fake gang tattoos by real gang

(00:04:35):

members I don’t know if that’s an urban legend but like so my first thought was I’m

(00:04:39):

gonna get this tattoo of where my kids are from and find out that that’s some

(00:04:43):

Colombian drug cartel logo and like

(00:04:47):

Either that or it’s going to save your life.

(00:04:50):

Probably.

(00:04:51):

They’re going to be coming at you and you flash your tattoo.

(00:04:55):

And they’re going to be like, oh, he’s one of us.

(00:04:57):

El gringo.

(00:04:58):

It’s like the thing that saves you.

(00:04:59):

It’s like, yeah, that would be really good.

(00:05:01):

I just knew that I was going to be in a pool with my kids that I couldn’t speak to.

(00:05:04):

And they’re either going to offer me cocaine or I don’t know.

(00:05:09):

I’ve seen a lot of narcos and they never repeat a murder twice.

(00:05:12):

So I don’t know what they would come up with.

(00:05:15):

Oh, man.

(00:05:16):

So this is what podcasting is like, huh?

(00:05:18):

I guess so.

(00:05:18):

It kind of feels like just talking.

(00:05:20):

So far, it’s been very visual.

(00:05:22):

I do think this,

(00:05:23):

I think if you’re going to keep going in this way,

(00:05:25):

where you’re taking off layers of clothes,

(00:05:27):

you’re showing tattoos,

(00:05:30):

giving people questionable drinks,

(00:05:33):

this is something people need to see.

(00:05:34):

Well,

(00:05:34):

so far,

(00:05:35):

the only hookup I have with podcast equipment is you,

(00:05:38):

and you’ve proven yourself to not be a very good source.

(00:05:41):

Hey, I told you to get the right cables.

(00:05:44):

You got them.

(00:05:44):

You made it work.

(00:05:45):

Yeah, and

(00:05:46):

Those didn’t set you back too far, did they?

(00:05:48):

Yeah, those Amazon Basics $7 a cable really did the trick after two hours of troubleshooting.

(00:05:55):

All right, Ben Looters.

(00:05:57):

What makes you interesting?

(00:05:58):

Oh, man.

(00:06:00):

What makes me... That’s the first question?

(00:06:02):

No, the first question was, when did you feel like a loser?

(00:06:04):

And you already did that.

(00:06:04):

Oh, that’s true.

(00:06:05):

And the second question was, do you want to see all my tattoos?

(00:06:07):

That’s true.

(00:06:08):

We’re like halfway through the show.

(00:06:10):

We’re five minutes.

(00:06:11):

This is a seven-minute podcast.

(00:06:12):

Yeah.

(00:06:13):

We’re at the end where you reveal why I’m not, why I’m interesting.

(00:06:17):

The trick to editing this is you do everything in like reverse chronological order.

(00:06:21):

Oh man, what makes me interesting?

(00:06:24):

I mean, I think I’m like moderately interesting.

(00:06:29):

I think I have like,

(00:06:30):

when I talk to other people,

(00:06:32):

like I do feel like I have a pretty interesting job and like my origin story is

(00:06:38):

somewhat unique.

(00:06:39):

So I don’t know, I think I’m somewhat interesting.

(00:06:42):

Do you think I’m interesting, Chris?

(00:06:43):

I feel it’s a weird thing to be asked, like, what makes me interesting.

(00:06:46):

It feels like I have to,

(00:06:47):

like,

(00:06:48):

defend myself or do,

(00:06:49):

like,

(00:06:49):

the Midwestern thing where I’m like,

(00:06:51):

no,

(00:06:51):

I’m not interested.

(00:06:52):

Yeah, where you’re so modest that you just, you have to say I’m a very bland personality.

(00:06:56):

Yeah, exactly.

(00:06:58):

Because I think you’re very bland,

(00:07:00):

so I just don’t want to get into a conversation with you about your boring life.

(00:07:03):

Oh, man.

(00:07:04):

Well, no, I think you’re interesting, but I also think that, like,

(00:07:07):

I think that everyone’s interesting, they just don’t necessarily know it.

(00:07:10):

Oh, so I’m not special, is that what you’re saying?

(00:07:12):

No,

(00:07:12):

I’m saying I’m trying to decide whether or not you are,

(00:07:15):

and we’re going to see how this goes.

(00:07:17):

I will say this,

(00:07:18):

yes,

(00:07:18):

I do think you’re interesting,

(00:07:19):

but I also wanted to start,

(00:07:20):

other than the fact that you’re the only person I knew that had podcasting

(00:07:23):

equipment I could buy.

(00:07:23):

Other than that, I did want to, yeah, that part I was not aware of when I made this choice.

(00:07:30):

I did want to start with you because you were the person that I always feel like I

(00:07:34):

never get to say everything I want to say in a conversation.

(00:07:39):

So what I mean by that is there’s certain people who are like,

(00:07:42):

I think I’ll try to think three questions ahead because they’re so uninteresting

(00:07:47):

and be like,

(00:07:48):

oh man,

(00:07:49):

I’m stuck with this person for another 45 minutes.

(00:07:50):

Okay,

(00:07:51):

what are the three conversation starters that I kind of think might get them to do

(00:07:54):

something?

(00:07:55):

With you, it’s the opposite.

(00:07:56):

I come up with,

(00:07:57):

as you’re talking,

(00:07:58):

I think of three different routes we can go on that conversation.

(00:08:02):

Want to see my tattoo?

(00:08:18):

It’s really just Chris looking for an opportunity to show me his tattoos.

(00:08:21):

That’s what this whole podcast is about.

(00:08:23):

So I knew we could at least fill up 45 minutes,

(00:08:25):

but I have gone into lunch appointments before with you.

(00:08:28):

Appointments.

(00:08:28):

Appointments.

(00:08:29):

Yeah, because I’m your client.

(00:08:31):

So there are appointments now.

(00:08:32):

It used to be we would get lunch as friends.

(00:08:34):

Yeah, yeah.

(00:08:34):

It used to be friends.

(00:08:35):

Now it’s all transactional.

(00:08:37):

Business expense.

(00:08:38):

So now when I do my business meetings with you, like any good...

(00:08:42):

All right so here’s my list though all right so you were this is what I know about

(00:08:45):

you based off of what I wrote down

(00:09:10):

Our typewriter.

(00:09:11):

You were born in Japan.

(00:09:12):

That’s right.

(00:09:13):

Wow.

(00:09:13):

You grew up in Hawaii.

(00:09:14):

That’s right.

(00:09:15):

Your dad was a chaplain for some military something or other.

(00:09:18):

Okay.

(00:09:18):

Not a chaplain.

(00:09:20):

Okay.

(00:09:21):

Okay.

(00:09:21):

Here’s where you might.

(00:09:22):

So my dad is actually a Vietnamese linguist.

(00:09:24):

He had a mustache.

(00:09:25):

He did have a mustache.

(00:09:26):

I remember that part.

(00:09:27):

Vietnamese linguist in the military, in the air force.

(00:09:30):

And his job was searching for remains in the Vietnam War.

(00:09:36):

I just thought he was some guy that did a bunch of boring church services.

(00:09:39):

No.

(00:09:40):

Where you might be confused.

(00:09:41):

He’s an elder now in a church.

(00:09:44):

Okay.

(00:09:44):

He got boring.

(00:09:45):

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(00:09:46):

But he was cool.

(00:09:48):

My dad was like literal Indiana Jones.

(00:09:51):

Like he went to the jungles of Vietnam and Thailand.

(00:09:55):

He had like a machete.

(00:09:56):

And when you’re doing this job,

(00:09:58):

he’s a military guy,

(00:09:59):

but he’s not allowed to wear military uniforms,

(00:10:01):

so he’s wearing a boonie hat and a button-up unbuttoned.

(00:10:07):

It’s kind of cool.

(00:10:08):

Wait, button-up unbuttoned?

(00:10:09):

Describe that.

(00:10:10):

It’s like Indiana Jones.

(00:10:12):

It’s hot outside, and he has to unbutton a couple.

(00:10:16):

I see.

(00:10:16):

He was a really, really cool dad.

(00:10:19):

And I have all these, I don’t know, just imaginative...

(00:10:25):

We did go to a church where we had to bring a machete and that’s why you in the

(00:10:30):

jungle vacation Bible schools in Hawaii are a lot different that’s right we just

(00:10:34):

did really really

(00:10:59):

Okay, so that brings us to point number three on my list.

(00:11:04):

You grew up in Hawaii.

(00:11:05):

Your dad was not a chaplain.

(00:11:06):

You had something way more interesting that I already forgot.

(00:11:09):

You lived in Maryland for a while?

(00:11:10):

I did.

(00:11:12):

Two tours in Maryland.

(00:11:13):

Okay, two tours.

(00:11:15):

Yeah, I mean, it’s like you get stationed.

(00:11:17):

And my dad...

(00:11:19):

Okay, you should really interview my dad.

(00:11:20):

He’s more interesting.

(00:11:21):

We’ll do that next.

(00:11:22):

When we lived in Hawaii...

(00:11:24):

That’s when my dad would go and do the Vietnamese linguist thing over in Vietnam.

(00:11:29):

He’d take these trips.

(00:11:30):

In Maryland, he worked for the National Security Agency.

(00:11:33):

So he was the guy that was stealing everyone’s phone conversation post 9-11.

(00:11:37):

Yeah, basically.

(00:11:40):

I honestly didn’t know that was a thing before that broke with the Edward Snowden

(00:11:44):

and everything.

(00:11:44):

So the NSA has been stealing our information for longer than I thought.

(00:11:47):

Oh, yeah.

(00:11:47):

Well, so here’s the crazy thing.

(00:11:49):

When I was a kid,

(00:11:51):

and when we were living in Maryland,

(00:11:52):

it was in the 90s,

(00:11:53):

both times,

(00:11:54):

like early 90s and then late 90s,

(00:11:56):

and he used to always say,

(00:11:58):

hey,

(00:11:58):

if I told you,

(00:11:59):

you know,

(00:12:00):

what I did for a living,

(00:12:01):

I’d have to kill you.

(00:12:02):

He loved saying that.

(00:12:03):

Like, whether that was true.

(00:12:04):

He sounds like a green dad.

(00:12:05):

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(00:12:06):

But it just filled you with, like, one word.

(00:12:08):

Dread and terror.

(00:12:09):

Yeah, it was like, what?

(00:12:11):

If he accidentally did, would he just kill us?

(00:12:13):

I don’t know.

(00:12:14):

He had a hard day at work and said, man, I get tired of spying on Fidel today.

(00:12:18):

He’s like, ah, shit, Ben’s here.

(00:12:21):

Well, the funny thing is all that stuff, though, that he was doing is all declassified.

(00:12:25):

Now, he was still sticking to this line of, oh, I can’t tell you, can’t tell you.

(00:12:29):

Then one day,

(00:12:31):

like a few years ago I got him to tell me and I even recorded it because again he

(00:12:36):

can talk about it and it’s the craziest thing yeah again this is why he should be

(00:12:40):

on the podcast does he even want to talk about it like is he like is it just

(00:12:42):

something that’s so uninteresting to him no it’s I think he’s actually he’s quite

(00:12:47):

fascinated by the whole thing but basically think of this

(00:12:51):

When we left Vietnam, the Vietnam War.

(00:12:53):

We as in?

(00:12:54):

The Americans.

(00:12:55):

Okay.

(00:12:55):

Me and you.

(00:12:56):

When we lost.

(00:12:57):

When we went.

(00:12:57):

When you and I lost the Vietnam War.

(00:12:58):

I didn’t know we went there.

(00:13:01):

We left all of this equipment over there.

(00:13:03):

Just like we did with Afghanistan a few years back.

(00:13:06):

Whenever we leave somewhere.

(00:13:07):

You know way more about wars than I do.

(00:13:09):

Brilliant war.

(00:13:10):

That’s why I’m interested.

(00:13:11):

But basically we left all of this communication equipment and all of our stuff there.

(00:13:15):

We just left.

(00:13:17):

But part of it is kind of a strategic thing, because we know how to access all that stuff.

(00:13:21):

So basically, we’ve been spying.

(00:13:23):

After the war, we were actually spying on the Vietnamese using their own equipment.

(00:13:29):

And my dad was part of that.

(00:13:30):

He was translating stuff that they’re saying, because this was before ChatGPT or whatever.

(00:13:33):

Were they saying, hey, what is this thing?

(00:13:35):

How does it work?

(00:13:41):

I think I can share this, but if not, my dad might kill me once this goes live.

(00:13:48):

Good, because I’m running out of questions for you already.

(00:13:54):

I will not be a repeat guest.

(00:13:55):

Not at all.

(00:13:57):

Okay, well we’re off to a good start.

(00:13:58):

You went back to Hawaii.

(00:14:00):

Yep.

(00:14:02):

This is where I get sketchy because this is a story you told me and I didn’t really

(00:14:06):

understand all the nuances of it.

(00:14:08):

You’re writing this all down.

(00:14:09):

Yeah, well I can’t write it down.

(00:14:10):

I was trying to be a good friend and listen to you, but I mean a good business partner.

(00:14:14):

You fell in love with a girl and she moved away, right?

(00:14:18):

Yes.

(00:14:18):

And you thought she was the one.

(00:14:21):

It wasn’t just like

(00:14:23):

You legitimately thought you were going to marry her.

(00:14:26):

I was 12 and she was 9 and I have a song called 12 and 9.

(00:14:29):

By my favorite band.

(00:14:30):

You might remember this.

(00:14:35):

You down.

(00:14:36):

Yeah, so we were kids together.

(00:14:38):

We grew up.

(00:14:38):

We were both homeschool Christian families.

(00:14:42):

We went to the same church.

(00:14:43):

We had all this stuff in common.

(00:14:45):

And it was just like, yeah, young love kind of a thing.

(00:14:48):

But it just never really went away.

(00:14:50):

And then it get to a point where I don’t even really know her,

(00:14:54):

but it’s just built up in my head.

(00:14:56):

You know what I mean?

(00:14:57):

You just feel like you have to marry this person.

(00:15:00):

I’m a very loyal person, and it just like...

(00:15:02):

It felt like I had to, kind of.

(00:15:06):

It felt like I was already married to her.

(00:15:07):

It was fate, inevitable.

(00:15:09):

We never even held hands or anything, but I just feel like I have to.

(00:15:14):

This is the one.

(00:15:16):

She moves away, and then what’s the question?

(00:15:20):

Then what happens?

(00:15:23):

My next part was found her after you moved back to the continental U.S.,

(00:15:28):

asked her parents for a blessing to court or date,

(00:15:30):

maybe marry one day,

(00:15:31):

and your dad shot you down.

(00:15:34):

Her dad shot me down.

(00:15:35):

What happened was,

(00:15:39):

their family retired to Virginia,

(00:15:41):

and I ended up in Nebraska,

(00:15:43):

finished up some school.

(00:15:45):

And here I am, literally like 20 years old, finishing up community college.

(00:15:50):

When was the last time you saw her?

(00:15:52):

Or been in communication with her?

(00:15:54):

Like, was it a long-distance thing at that point?

(00:15:55):

Or just... Oh, yeah.

(00:15:56):

So they had been in Virginia for a while, and I had been in Nebraska and stuff.

(00:15:59):

And so...

(00:16:00):

But you’re still in contact.

(00:16:01):

Still in contact.

(00:16:02):

I was driving out there and seeing her and her family.

(00:16:05):

I flew out there at least once.

(00:16:10):

And anyways, I...

(00:16:13):

Up to this point, we’ve been together, quote unquote, for like since I was 12.

(00:16:19):

And we’re not an official relationship because we don’t really believe in that.

(00:16:22):

We kissed dating goodbye.

(00:16:23):

Okay.

(00:16:24):

Chris.

(00:16:25):

As I did as well.

(00:16:26):

And this is even technically a sanctioned like courtship,

(00:16:29):

but it’s just like this thing that Meg and I joke about it.

(00:16:32):

You’re saving yourself for marriage that may never happen because you can’t tell

(00:16:35):

somebody you like them.

(00:16:36):

So, I mean, it’s like pluses and minuses.

(00:16:39):

I mean, the plus, I guess, is that like

(00:16:42):

Because it was so unofficial and restricted, we don’t really have any regrets, I guess.

(00:16:48):

We never did anything, but we also didn’t really get to know each other.

(00:16:51):

So when her dad finally said,

(00:16:53):

hey,

(00:16:54):

don’t bother coming out here again,

(00:16:55):

because I was planning one last trip to see if we could make this work,

(00:16:59):

and he was like,

(00:17:00):

the thing he said was,

(00:17:01):

save the gas,

(00:17:02):

save the gas.

(00:17:04):

And I actually received it pretty well.

(00:17:06):

At that point, I had kind of gotten to the point where I’m like,

(00:17:09):

I don’t know if this is the right way.

(00:17:12):

I didn’t really know her.

(00:17:13):

I felt like we had been so...

(00:17:17):

Isolated from one another and we’d grown into different people.

(00:17:21):

It turns out she liked horses more than she liked people and she was living out in

(00:17:26):

the country and she ended up marrying this country doctor widower guy that was like

(00:17:31):

her dad’s age.

(00:17:32):

Really into horses.

(00:17:33):

Yeah,

(00:17:34):

they have horses I think and it’s a whole different lifestyle and I was this

(00:17:38):

graphic designer in the big city of Omaha and so it never would have worked.

(00:17:42):

Absolutely.

(00:17:43):

City folk just don’t understand them bumpkins us Nebraskans

(00:17:48):

Yeah,

(00:17:49):

but I mean,

(00:17:49):

like,

(00:17:50):

on the more spiritual side of it all,

(00:17:52):

now,

(00:17:53):

you’ll probably laugh at this,

(00:17:54):

but I listened to a Mark Driscoll sermon when I was driving back.

(00:17:58):

At the time, that was a good thing to do, but now we know better.

(00:18:02):

Well, it’s funny, because I wasn’t going to, like, an Acts 29 church or anything.

(00:18:06):

I was going to a really conservative,

(00:18:07):

like,

(00:18:07):

Presbyterian church,

(00:18:08):

and so listening to Mark Driscoll was edgy.

(00:18:09):

You didn’t get yelled at a lot.

(00:18:10):

Yeah, you didn’t get yelled at a lot yet.

(00:18:11):

I needed to.

(00:18:12):

So, like, I actually really, it was, like, a guilty pleasure listening to Mark Driscoll.

(00:18:15):

Oh, I’m sure.

(00:18:16):

But he basically was saying— That’s what he was going for, I think.

(00:18:18):

Oh yeah, for sure.

(00:18:19):

I mean, that Song of Solomon sermon series was...

(00:18:22):

I listened to all of that.

(00:18:24):

I learned a lot.

(00:18:26):

Didn’t we all?

(00:18:28):

Us kids at Kiss Dating Goodbye, now we have a pastor writing a book about anal sex.

(00:18:32):

Yeah, there you go.

(00:18:33):

So anyways,

(00:18:34):

when I was driving back from her family’s property in Virginia for the last time,

(00:18:40):

what ended up being the last time,

(00:18:44):

I turned on this sermon,

(00:18:46):

and he was just talking about...

(00:18:48):

Basically not making an idol out of things and being able to...

(00:18:51):

You know it’s not an idol in your life if you can go either way.

(00:18:54):

No matter what the decision is, you’re happy to go either way.

(00:18:59):

I did start really thinking about that and praying about that and being like, I need to...

(00:19:04):

It’s at a point right now where if this falls apart, I’m devastated.

(00:19:08):

I was like, this is ridiculous.

(00:19:09):

I don’t even know this person.

(00:19:11):

I had to let go of her.

(00:19:12):

When that call came, I was able to...

(00:19:16):

Yeah, I didn’t even shed a tear.

(00:19:17):

It was just like, alright, this is confirmation.

(00:19:19):

Move on.

(00:19:20):

And at that same time,

(00:19:23):

the woman I’m currently married to,

(00:19:25):

I already knew her and was getting to know her family.

(00:19:29):

So it was kind of like, a lot of people looked like a really quick

(00:19:32):

uh you know kind of what do you call that a rebound yeah relationship but really

(00:19:36):

like I had known her for many years as like a friend and was a part of her church

(00:19:42):

and a lot of stuff like that and so it looked like a quick rebound but really like

(00:19:46):

it wasn’t you know but I mean it sounds like you Meg your wife and this other this

(00:19:54):

horse horse gal sounds

(00:19:55):

It sounds like you’re basically like at the same you knew that as much about both

(00:19:58):

of them like the same about both of them yeah basically I feel like it wasn’t that

(00:20:02):

different the way you describe it at least think about this like in this like kind

(00:20:06):

of like ultra kind of conservative more restrictive you know whatever purity

(00:20:12):

culture buzzwords kind of culture um I love purity culture that’s that’s the name

(00:20:18):

of this podcast you seem like the type

(00:20:21):

You got all this cherub face energy Yeah It worked for me Mr.

(00:20:26):

Crud I like know Josh Harris now and I know he’s rejected it all but it’s like dude

(00:20:31):

it worked for me thanks for the book

(00:20:34):

Can you get him on the path?

(00:20:35):

So this is, we need to get Josh Harris and your dad.

(00:20:37):

That’s why you brought me here to, you gave me a couple drinks.

(00:20:40):

So part three, you’ve met Josh Harris and you’re willing to introduce him to me.

(00:20:44):

Yeah, that’d probably be a more interesting podcast.

(00:20:46):

But no, so basically like- You only guessed one.

(00:20:49):

When you’re not,

(00:20:49):

and I even think about this now,

(00:20:51):

like with my own kids as they get to that age,

(00:20:53):

like trying to just stay-

(00:20:56):

By C.S.

(00:20:56):

Beaty

(00:21:20):

I knew Megan as just like a girl that went to church and she was like hanging out

(00:21:23):

in groups and she was a friend I was not interested in her that way at all because

(00:21:26):

to be honest I thought one of my best friends was going to probably marry her

(00:21:29):

because he was kind of crazy about her and so and then came Ben and then yeah and

(00:21:34):

then he he found someone else and things fell apart with this other girl and it all

(00:21:38):

just kind of worked out but but I had all that time to just kind of see her as a

(00:21:42):

person you know and so then when you know

(00:21:45):

The romance could happen.

(00:21:48):

It just happened.

(00:21:49):

Did you feel like you were allowed to have romance, though?

(00:21:51):

Or even just be interested in someone?

(00:21:54):

I definitely felt like I could be interested because it was a very public,

(00:21:58):

unofficial relationship.

(00:22:01):

It was weird.

(00:22:02):

Exclusive, in a sense.

(00:22:03):

It was.

(00:22:04):

Everyone knew about it.

(00:22:05):

It was so understood.

(00:22:07):

Everyone knew we were an item, but it was unofficial.

(00:22:10):

So that’s the tricky part.

(00:22:11):

I don’t know what to really do with that.

(00:22:14):

Everyone was so afraid to put a label on it because they felt like,

(00:22:18):

well,

(00:22:18):

if you put a label on it,

(00:22:19):

then it’s official,

(00:22:20):

you’re getting married.

(00:22:21):

There was no real

(00:22:23):

We didn’t know what to do in that culture.

(00:22:26):

We didn’t know what to do with a relationship that wasn’t basically engagement or marriage.

(00:22:34):

And so he felt kind of betrothed, I guess.

(00:22:37):

Kind of like the old Jewish betrothal kind of feeling, I guess.

(00:22:42):

Where it’s kind of like, someday I’m going to marry so-and-so.

(00:22:45):

But until that time, enjoy your blue balls.

(00:22:47):

Exactly.

(00:22:48):

So that’s basically where I was.

(00:22:49):

All right, next part.

(00:22:52):

Yeah.

(00:22:53):

I feel like we could do a whole podcast episode on this because I can’t help but

(00:22:58):

put your experience on top of mine and compare and contrast because in some sense I

(00:23:03):

can totally identify with everything but I felt I was afraid to even talk to a girl

(00:23:08):

so that whole idea of being even it being understood that you knew somebody that

(00:23:12):

was exclusive even though if it wasn’t a label even that to me it wasn’t even so it

(00:23:20):

wasn’t allowed I was just terrified of it

(00:23:22):

By C.S.

(00:23:22):

Beaty

(00:23:46):

I don’t think I could come back from it.

(00:23:48):

I had such a fear of that.

(00:23:50):

We had no category for asking girls out.

(00:23:52):

That’s true.

(00:23:54):

I know what you mean though.

(00:23:55):

I’m trying to think back.

(00:23:58):

I did have a lot of friends that were girls.

(00:24:03):

I had a lot of...

(00:24:04):

I think because no one was dating, no one was even really courting or anything.

(00:24:09):

My older brother...

(00:24:11):

The first courtship I ever heard of courted my best friend’s big sister and they were married.

(00:24:20):

They were both 19.

(00:24:21):

They were both married.

(00:24:22):

They’re still married.

(00:24:23):

They’ve got six kids.

(00:24:24):

They live in the Seattle area.

(00:24:30):

Because there was no real official thing unless you’re ready to get married.

(00:24:35):

We would say things like

(00:24:38):

Don’t shop until you’re ready to buy.

(00:24:39):

Don’t stir up love before it pleases.

(00:24:41):

I think that’s from Song of Solomon.

(00:24:43):

That was kind of the mindset.

(00:24:44):

It’s been a while since I’ve listened to that sermon series.

(00:24:47):

Mark Driscoll, he’s been cancelled a few times since then.

(00:24:51):

He’s still going strong.

(00:24:53):

Yeah, which one?

(00:24:56):

But anyway, can you even find that old stuff?

(00:24:58):

Does it exist somewhere?

(00:24:59):

I’m sure somebody has it somewhere.

(00:25:00):

Some creepy guy’s got that in his basement.

(00:25:02):

Probably down here somewhere.

(00:25:03):

Oh, I’ve got it all, yeah.

(00:25:04):

You’ve got it all?

(00:25:05):

I bet I have it on an iPod still.

(00:25:07):

Yeah, no kidding.

(00:25:08):

But yeah, basically, I don’t know.

(00:25:12):

Because there wasn’t really any real relationship status you could kind of hope

(00:25:17):

for,

(00:25:17):

it was all very...

(00:25:20):

I don’t know.

(00:25:20):

We could just kind of be friends, too, and it was kind of cool.

(00:25:23):

Except for,

(00:25:24):

I mean,

(00:25:24):

I don’t know,

(00:25:24):

for me and that other girl,

(00:25:26):

we just kind of thought,

(00:25:29):

without expressing it to one another,

(00:25:31):

that someday we’d be married.

(00:25:32):

I don’t know.

(00:25:33):

But the culture or the community kind of reinforces some of those things, too.

(00:25:37):

Oh, for sure.

(00:25:37):

You know what I mean?

(00:25:38):

Absolutely.

(00:25:39):

I look back on it and it’s like why did I fall so head over heels for her and part

(00:25:44):

of it was because I overheard other people talking about us and it made me feel

(00:25:47):

good it’d be like oh man you see those two what a cute couple and someday and you

(00:25:52):

know we were both into music and that can also help she wrote songs I wrote songs

(00:25:57):

and that just like it kind of just fit this storybook image you know in my head and

(00:26:04):

so I don’t know like I said purity culture worked great for me um

(00:26:10):

That’s the name of my book.

(00:26:11):

Our next guest would just talk to myself and read my own book out loud.

(00:26:16):

Actually, just listen to my audio book and you can hear my take on that or my response.

(00:26:24):

Next question.

(00:26:24):

Okay, next question.

(00:26:25):

We’re 25 minutes in.

(00:26:27):

We’ve covered the Vietnam War.

(00:26:29):

We’re doing this podcast.

(00:26:31):

All right, so I put at some point got married to someone else.

(00:26:35):

So you skipped ahead a little bit.

(00:26:37):

Meg.

(00:26:37):

Meg.

(00:26:38):

Who is now the mother of a lot of kids.

(00:26:41):

Too many to count.

(00:26:42):

Yeah, we’ve got five kiddos.

(00:26:44):

Rounding up to ten.

(00:26:45):

That’s right.

(00:26:45):

And we have been married for 16 years as of last week.

(00:26:50):

So, yeah, it’s going great.

(00:26:53):

It’s awesome.

(00:26:54):

That is great.

(00:26:54):

That is great to hear.

(00:26:56):

And I don’t believe you.

(00:26:58):

You mentioned this a little bit.

(00:27:01):

So you’re a designer.

(00:27:03):

That’s right.

(00:27:04):

Graphic designer, branding designer.

(00:27:07):

So you started doing that.

(00:27:09):

Was it Metro Community College?

(00:27:10):

Did the program there?

(00:27:12):

How did this all come about?

(00:27:13):

Yeah, yeah.

(00:27:14):

So that...

(00:27:15):

Good question, Chris.

(00:27:17):

Thank you.

(00:27:17):

I’ve been told I’m good at this.

(00:27:19):

You are good at this.

(00:27:19):

Wow.

(00:27:20):

I feel so seen and heard by you.

(00:27:23):

I’m not listening, but I can see you.

(00:27:26):

I was homeschooled all the way through.

(00:27:29):

Well, all the way until I started going to college early.

(00:27:32):

So that’s kind of the thing with homeschoolers,

(00:27:34):

the really smart ones,

(00:27:36):

or the ones whose parents run out of patience and things for them to do at home.

(00:27:40):

When they’re about 15 or 16 they’ll like get early enrollment into a community

(00:27:44):

college or take the GED I actually took the GED when I was 16 and started going to

(00:27:50):

take various classes at various community colleges in Hawaii so there was one

(00:27:56):

called Windward Community College on the Windward side of Oahu

(00:28:01):

The main one was Leeward Community College on the Leeward side of the island.

(00:28:05):

They are so good at naming.

(00:28:07):

It’s kind of lame.

(00:28:09):

But it’s funny.

(00:28:10):

I was training to be a classical pianist.

(00:28:15):

I need to pronounce that better.

(00:28:19):

What is a classical pianist?

(00:28:22):

Pianist.

(00:28:23):

Pianist.

(00:28:23):

I think I said that right.

(00:28:26):

And I was convinced that I was, yeah, music was where it was at.

(00:28:30):

And so I started just taking electives of like ear training,

(00:28:35):

of theory,

(00:28:36):

music theory,

(00:28:38):

some classical guitar.

(00:28:40):

Lots of just music-related classes.

(00:28:43):

And I just fell into, accidentally fell into the world of graphic design.

(00:28:49):

My dad’s a military guy.

(00:28:51):

Everyone I knew was basically a military guy or worked on garage doors.

(00:28:54):

There was no category.

(00:28:57):

I was creative.

(00:28:58):

I always liked to draw.

(00:28:59):

I didn’t know there were so many garages in Hawaii.

(00:29:03):

More than you might think.

(00:29:04):

I didn’t have one, but some rich people have them, I guess.

(00:29:08):

But

(00:29:09):

I had no category.

(00:29:10):

I didn’t even think about how everything that you see.

(00:29:13):

I’m looking down and seeing all of these.

(00:29:15):

If only we had a video.

(00:29:16):

Yeah, if only we had a video.

(00:29:17):

All of these coasters in front of me and cool bottle designs you have up in your

(00:29:25):

beautiful bar here.

(00:29:27):

I never even thought that someone had to design all this stuff.

(00:29:29):

Someone had to draw all this stuff.

(00:29:32):

And...

(00:29:33):

I stumbled into it.

(00:29:34):

Literally,

(00:29:36):

this gal at my church asked me,

(00:29:39):

she said,

(00:29:40):

hey,

(00:29:40):

do you know anybody in the University of Hawaii school system that has an artistic

(00:29:48):

eye?

(00:29:48):

That’s what she said.

(00:29:49):

And I was like, well, that’s a very specific question.

(00:29:51):

It’s a weird way of asking that.

(00:29:53):

An artistic eye.

(00:29:55):

I know somebody has an astigmatism.

(00:30:10):

They were working for this research division of the University of Hawaii called the

(00:30:15):

Hawaii Coral Reef Initiative.

(00:30:18):

Not made up, but basically they helped raise money for scientists studying the coral reef.

(00:30:24):

And they needed someone to help them with publications about coral reef health.

(00:30:30):

How do we make this not boring?

(00:30:32):

Yeah, exactly.

(00:30:33):

And so she’s like,

(00:30:34):

do you know anybody in the University of Hawaii system who has an artistic eye?

(00:30:38):

That’s how she’s

(00:30:39):

I’ll let you know if someone comes to mind and then it was like literally three

(00:30:43):

days later I go wait a second

(00:30:46):

I go to Leeward Community College,

(00:30:49):

which is technically a part of the University of Hawaii system.

(00:30:53):

It’s not the University of Hawaii main campus, but it’s all part of the same system.

(00:30:58):

And I have an artistic eye.

(00:31:00):

Now,

(00:31:00):

if she had said,

(00:31:01):

who is a graphic designer or knows how to use Photoshop or something like that,

(00:31:05):

I would have no clue because I was not aware of that profession.

(00:31:09):

I’d never used an Adobe product like Photoshop or Illustrator, anything like that.

(00:31:14):

But she said artistic eye and I loved at that time I was doing a lot of drawing

(00:31:18):

caricatures of my friends so I just drew a lot for fun in between music classes and

(00:31:23):

stuff and piano lessons and things that I thought were like what I was going to do

(00:31:27):

and so a few days later I like reached out and I’m like I think that’s me

(00:31:33):

And so I go down to my first and one of my only job interviews ever,

(00:31:37):

which wasn’t really a job interview.

(00:31:38):

They just gave me the job because it was a student help job.

(00:31:42):

You didn’t get paid.

(00:31:44):

Barely.

(00:31:44):

It was a very small amount of pay, very few hours a week.

(00:31:49):

And they paid for me to learn all of the programs.

(00:31:54):

I took a non-credit Photoshop class,

(00:31:56):

a non-credit Illustrator class,

(00:31:58):

a non-credit,

(00:32:00):

it was before InDesign,

(00:32:02):

it was called PageMaker,

(00:32:03):

Adobe PageMaker.

(00:32:05):

And I got introduced to this crazy world that everything we see

(00:32:10):

is like designed and made and people will pay for you to do this stuff and logos

(00:32:15):

and it was like overwhelming because like I did have this artistic eye and so

(00:32:21):

immediately I just started shifting all of my studies towards the visual arts and I

(00:32:29):

also happened to run into this like retired Disney animator who was living in

(00:32:33):

Hawaii and

(00:32:34):

And teaching He’s the guy His name is Dan Boulos If you’re listening Dan Dan Boulos

(00:32:40):

Dan Boulos Look him up I need another podcast guest Dan Boulos Seriously I should

(00:32:44):

reach out to him He’s still around I think he still lives in Hawaii But if you look

(00:32:48):

him up He is the one that animated the wolves In Beauty and the Beast I think he

(00:32:53):

animated

(00:32:54):

Mrs.

(00:32:55):

Potts and Chip because everyone animates a different thing he animated at that time

(00:33:01):

the animation you actually had to draw it sell animation by him and he also

(00:33:07):

animated I think Flounder from Little Mermaid then he also did some stuff with

(00:33:12):

Quest for Camelot not Disney so he was this old school animator but he was teaching

(00:33:18):

some of the graphic design and animation classes in Hawaii at the community college

(00:33:23):

And it just opened me up to this whole world.

(00:33:26):

So at first I thought I’d be a storyboard artist for like Pixar or something.

(00:33:31):

But then I just, I kind of went all in on this Hawaii coral reef initiative.

(00:33:35):

And I ended up working there seven years.

(00:33:36):

Even after I graduated, I kept the job.

(00:33:39):

Even when I moved to Omaha and I married Meg, I kept that job.

(00:33:44):

That’s what I bought my first house on was this job.

(00:33:46):

No coral reefs in Omaha, by the way.

(00:33:49):

Yeah, no coral reefs here.

(00:33:51):

But I was literally,

(00:33:53):

when I was first married,

(00:33:55):

living here,

(00:33:55):

I was working full time for the Hawaii Coral Reef Initiative and I was doing remote

(00:34:01):

work from my basement way before it was cool.

(00:34:04):

In 2010,

(00:34:05):

2011,

(00:34:07):

working for this organization in Hawaii,

(00:34:10):

drawing pictures of fish all day and doing publication design and layout.

(00:34:16):

It was insane.

(00:34:17):

So what would they do with your fish?

(00:34:19):

Okay,

(00:34:20):

so the big thing that we did,

(00:34:21):

we did a few things,

(00:34:22):

but the big thing that we did was we created this really cool interactive public

(00:34:29):

school science curriculum for Hawaii public schools called Reef Pulse Hawaii,

(00:34:34):

where it ended up being a thousand-page curriculum with full-color illustrations

(00:34:39):

that I did.

(00:34:40):

So no kids reading that.

(00:34:42):

Yeah, exactly.

(00:34:43):

Seven years wasted.

(00:34:45):

I don’t know if this was ever used, to be honest.

(00:34:47):

It’s like a seven year project.

(00:34:49):

I kid you not.

(00:34:50):

But the interesting part was it was so tailored to my skills that there was also

(00:34:58):

this whole science song component and I wrote and recorded

(00:35:04):

like I think 30 science songs wow for kids it’s a part of the school bus yeah it’s

(00:35:10):

like that and it was I got to explore all these different styles of music I mean

(00:35:14):

some of it’s better than others other parts of it you know it’s rough around the

(00:35:17):

edges but it’s just funny because I had this like little mini career where I had to

(00:35:21):

learn publication design I had to learn illustration I had to learn music recording

(00:35:26):

you’d think I’d be better at recording podcasts and stuff

(00:35:31):

But yeah, it was like so weird.

(00:35:35):

Like I got to do all this stuff.

(00:35:36):

And the other crazy part about it too is my younger brother Abe,

(00:35:41):

he worked for them as well doing web design and video stuff and animation.

(00:35:44):

And so him and I were like,

(00:35:47):

Before I married Meg,

(00:35:48):

we were living together and going to school here in Omaha and both working for the

(00:35:52):

Hawaii Coral Reef Initiative and doing all this crazy stuff together,

(00:35:56):

making flash websites and even storyboards for animated science videos.

(00:36:03):

It was wild.

(00:36:04):

At 17, 18, 19 years old.

(00:36:07):

It was wild.

(00:36:07):

So that was your full-time job?

(00:36:09):

It turned into a full-time job.

(00:36:10):

It started part-time, turned into a full-time job with benefits.

(00:36:15):

I feel like that happens to every artist.

(00:36:23):

Now I’m back there.

(00:36:24):

Now I do this again.

(00:36:25):

Way to bury the lead.

(00:36:27):

That was my funny part at the end.

(00:36:29):

I’m going to read the last bullet here.

(00:36:32):

And now you’re living in your parents’ basement and talking to me as the very first

(00:36:36):

guest on a podcast that didn’t exist until this very interview.

(00:36:40):

that was that was the return home part of the hero’s journey but we skipped all the

(00:36:44):

good parts all the good parts yeah well it is funny because like yeah I literally

(00:36:48):

yeah as Chris just uh gave away I go by C.S.

(00:36:52):

Beaty we C.S.

(00:36:54):

Beaty uh just gave away um B.A.

(00:36:58):

Looters over here um

(00:37:05):

We sold our Benson home and we’re looking for a house and living with my parents.

(00:37:09):

So I am living in my parents’ basement and running my design studio out of my

(00:37:15):

parents’ basement at the moment.

(00:37:17):

Hopefully not forever.

(00:37:18):

I wish I was in your basement.

(00:37:19):

Look how cool this is.

(00:37:20):

My basement is way better than your parents’ basement.

(00:37:24):

I should move in.

(00:37:25):

If you take one of my three kids and have the basement.

(00:37:28):

I promise I won’t.

(00:37:29):

I will take that trade.

(00:37:30):

Well, your kids are probably better than mine.

(00:37:32):

I could probably I’d probably bring one of them I’ve got a lot of kids I don’t know

(00:37:35):

I wouldn’t even notice you probably wouldn’t even notice so alright so let’s fill

(00:37:39):

in these gaps here so how did you end up in Omaha yeah yeah okay so this is

(00:37:44):

actually so somewhat easy so I again was going to community college in Hawaii

(00:37:49):

switching from music to design related stuff I have this part time job but I’m

(00:37:54):

still living at home I’m living with my parents I’m 18 and I turn 19 I’m like this

(00:37:59):

is getting crazy I need to move out

(00:38:01):

But Hawaii is the most expensive place to move in.

(00:38:04):

And so I’m looking at places that I could move in with maybe, I don’t know, six of my friends.

(00:38:08):

It’s like, okay, we’re going to have to split this a lot of different ways.

(00:38:12):

But a lot of them were going off to college in the mainland, as we call it.

(00:38:17):

And I was just realizing, oh man, this is going to be super expensive.

(00:38:21):

And that’s when my younger brother,

(00:38:23):

Abe,

(00:38:23):

who was really young,

(00:38:26):

because he’s homeschooled,

(00:38:26):

was going to community college since he was 14.

(00:38:28):

He was like,

(00:38:31):

Ben,

(00:38:32):

we get in-state tuition,

(00:38:33):

apparently,

(00:38:34):

this is true,

(00:38:35):

you get in-state tuition when you’re a military dependent,

(00:38:38):

and we word military dependents,

(00:38:40):

Where your parent in the military is stationed,

(00:38:46):

and I guess where they’re from,

(00:38:47):

like where their home base is,

(00:38:48):

I don’t understand,

(00:38:50):

which is technically Omaha.

(00:38:51):

So I would get in-state tuition in Hawaii,

(00:38:53):

where my dad was stationed,

(00:38:55):

or I would get in-state tuition in Omaha,

(00:38:57):

where my dad is from,

(00:38:58):

I guess.

(00:38:59):

And it was like, well, you look at out-of-state tuition, that was really expensive anywhere, and

(00:39:05):

But I was like, wow, I could move out in Omaha.

(00:39:07):

We started looking at prices of, like, apartments in Elkhorn, Nebraska, and stuff like that.

(00:39:12):

I’m like, you can buy three of these.

(00:39:13):

Dang, yeah, like, wow, I could do this.

(00:39:17):

I could pay half of this apartment, right?

(00:39:19):

So it just, like,

(00:39:21):

I was just like,

(00:39:21):

wow,

(00:39:22):

I’ll just go there,

(00:39:23):

finish up some school,

(00:39:24):

and then I’m sure I’ll move on to the East Coast,

(00:39:27):

the West Coast,

(00:39:28):

somewhere cool,

(00:39:29):

whatever.

(00:39:30):

I’ll be rich and famous.

(00:39:31):

I’ll figure it out.

(00:39:32):

Never thought I would stay here for very long.

(00:39:34):

It was like, this is where my grandparents were because my parents were from here.

(00:39:37):

But I was like, there’s no way I’m going to stay here for very long.

(00:39:40):

I’m going to finish up some school because it’s cheaper, and that’s it.

(00:39:45):

That’s not what happened.

(00:39:45):

But yeah, that’s what I thought.

(00:39:47):

No, we already covered that part.

(00:39:48):

No, we didn’t.

(00:39:50):

I don’t know where we’re at in this interview at this point.

(00:39:51):

Well,

(00:39:52):

basically,

(00:39:52):

I’m in Omaha,

(00:39:54):

and at the same time,

(00:39:56):

this girl that I thought I was going to marry,

(00:39:57):

her family relocates to Virginia,

(00:39:59):

and that’s where I keep on driving from Omaha,

(00:40:01):

Virginia,

(00:40:03):

trying to make this thing work.

(00:40:05):

It falls apart, and at the same time,

(00:40:08):

Megan is like and her family is a part of my life here in Omaha and it just it

(00:40:13):

moved pretty fast once everything fell apart the other girl it was like became

(00:40:16):

really clear oh dang

(00:40:18):

Why am I trying to marry this girl when I can marry this girl?

(00:40:21):

And so we were married pretty quickly after that.

(00:40:25):

So you met Meg through church?

(00:40:27):

Yeah.

(00:40:28):

She went to my church.

(00:40:28):

We were going to this small conservative Presbyterian church called Dominion

(00:40:34):

Covenant Church that still exists.

(00:40:37):

And my best friend was the pastor’s son, oldest son.

(00:40:41):

And he really liked Megan So I didn’t actually know her that well But he talked

(00:40:46):

about her all the time But he ended up moving away I could do a way better job with

(00:40:49):

her He moved away,

(00:40:50):

fell in love with someone else And I was in his wedding And realizing,

(00:40:55):

oh,

(00:40:55):

no one’s marrying Megan She’s available So I ended up marrying her She was super

(00:41:01):

cool It is funny I think you probably have this You have your heart so set on

(00:41:09):

something And then

(00:41:12):

You see what you should be attracted to or interested in or what’s actually compatible.

(00:41:24):

Meg and I are really well matched.

(00:41:26):

We’re totally opposites.

(00:41:28):

Totally opposites.

(00:41:30):

I’m an extrovert.

(00:41:30):

She’s an introvert.

(00:41:32):

She’s fiercely loyal.

(00:41:37):

I don’t know if you believe in the Enneagram.

(00:41:38):

That’s a big

(00:41:45):

I’m a big seven adventurer,

(00:41:48):

and she’s a one perfectionist kind of person,

(00:41:52):

if you believe in that sort of thing.

(00:41:53):

I hear some people do.

(00:41:55):

Yeah, some people do.

(00:41:56):

It’s fine.

(00:41:57):

I have conflicted feelings.

(00:41:59):

But anyways, we’re really different than one another, but it just kind of works.

(00:42:05):

Yeah.

(00:42:08):

Does the Enneagram think that you’re supposed to work?

(00:42:11):

That’s a good question.

(00:42:11):

I think it does.

(00:42:12):

I think opposites are supposed to attract.

(00:42:14):

When I think of the Enneagram,

(00:42:15):

I think of those placemats at Chinese restaurants that tell you the Chinese zodiac,

(00:42:18):

and it’s like,

(00:42:19):

if you’re a horse,

(00:42:20):

never marry a rat.

(00:42:23):

Which the real reason is because there’s an 18-year age gap,

(00:42:26):

and that’s probably not going to work

(00:42:27):

Maybe they’re on to something.

(00:42:30):

We do have a large age gap.

(00:42:31):

I will say that.

(00:42:34):

I’m very immature for my age and she’s very mature for age.

(00:42:38):

We meet in the middle.

(00:42:40):

Which leads me to the next part.

(00:42:41):

You started an app to sell flowers.

(00:42:44):

My gosh, Chris.

(00:42:45):

You’ve done your research.

(00:42:47):

I was friends with you when you did that.

(00:42:50):

That’s true.

(00:42:51):

I forgot about that.

(00:42:52):

So did everyone else.

(00:42:54):

I feel like I’m on Hot Ones right now.

(00:42:57):

I need some more of this it’s really good no it’s fine we’re just drinking like

(00:43:04):

sailors over here those of you on the video broadcast that’s right well I answer

(00:43:10):

this question Chris is like heading over to the bar but yeah so a couple friends

(00:43:15):

from church oh my gosh we’re getting straight bourbon here on the rocks okay

(00:43:22):

Anyways,

(00:43:23):

a couple friends from church,

(00:43:24):

they had this idea for a flower delivery app that we ended up calling Zinnia.

(00:43:31):

Basically, I was just starting my design company, Fruitful, at the time.

(00:43:37):

They were like, hey,

(00:43:39):

Maybe if we give Ben like part ownership in this thing,

(00:43:42):

he’ll do a bunch of design work for us on the cheap.

(00:43:46):

So I did get to like really do a lot of like UI, UX design for apps and homepage.

(00:43:54):

Ultimately, it ended up not really amounting to a whole lot.

(00:43:57):

But we did, you know, we got into like an accelerator or whatever you call that.

(00:44:02):

We raised some money.

(00:44:03):

I remember when that happened because I remember being told to pray for you.

(00:44:06):

You probably should have prayed some more.

(00:44:12):

It’s your fault.

(00:44:13):

Blame it on me.

(00:44:13):

I did buy flowers from you, though.

(00:44:15):

I thought that might actually help.

(00:44:16):

Well, we did end up selling.

(00:44:18):

We did sell to a florist in town.

(00:44:20):

I think Janusek Florist still has the site.

(00:44:22):

I think it still exists.

(00:44:24):

It’s kind of an old Squarespace site.

(00:44:26):

Could probably use an update.

(00:44:28):

But it ended up just being a lot smaller.

(00:44:31):

The original concept of it, Chris, was more of like...

(00:44:36):

It’s going to sound cliche.

(00:44:38):

More of like the Airbnb for florists,

(00:44:41):

where basically florists would be able to have an account and be able to sell their

(00:44:47):

flowers on this marketplace like Airbnb.

(00:44:51):

That was the idea initially.

(00:44:52):

But basically, we went through that accelerator.

(00:44:54):

They’re like, this is, oh, you pulled it up.

(00:44:56):

Yeah, no, it’s still there.

(00:44:57):

GoZidia.com.

(00:44:58):

I bought flowers from it.

(00:44:59):

It still exists.

(00:44:59):

It’s got your logo on it.

(00:45:01):

You made this logo, right?

(00:45:01):

Yeah, I made that logo.

(00:45:02):

Yeah, actually, Aaron Pilly and I did that.

(00:45:04):

I think Aaron really did the lettering on that.

(00:45:07):

Seems like your style.

(00:45:08):

GoZinnia.com to send flowers in Omaha.

(00:45:12):

If you’re in Omaha.

(00:45:13):

Only if you’re in Omaha.

(00:45:15):

And they come in a burlap sack.

(00:45:16):

Yeah,

(00:45:17):

basically the final version of Zinnia,

(00:45:19):

it went far away from the marketplace and it just became like,

(00:45:23):

hey,

(00:45:23):

if you order from,

(00:45:24):

you can order these set like bouquets from Zinnia,

(00:45:27):

GoZinnia.com and Janusek Florist will make them and drive them out and deliver

(00:45:32):

them.

(00:45:32):

And they’re all named after your wives.

(00:45:34):

Yeah, they were like all named after the wives of the founders.

(00:45:39):

Is there actually a Meg?

(00:45:40):

I can’t even remember.

(00:45:41):

Yeah,

(00:45:41):

I don’t remember what the arrangement was,

(00:45:43):

but I remember they’re all,

(00:45:43):

like,

(00:45:43):

how’d they come up with these?

(00:45:45):

Oh, yeah, it’s their wives’ names.

(00:45:46):

Yeah, it’s kind of creepy, isn’t it?

(00:45:48):

Yeah, everyone knows our wives.

(00:45:49):

I’ve done buying those Megan flowers.

(00:45:50):

The Megan flowers.

(00:45:53):

Gross.

(00:45:54):

Oh, man.

(00:45:55):

Canceled.

(00:45:57):

Canceled before even, we didn’t even release the first podcast, and it’s already been canceled.

(00:46:01):

That’s so funny.

(00:46:02):

I kind of, like,

(00:46:04):

yeah I’ve forgotten that I learned a lot of stuff during that that phase it was

(00:46:08):

kind of kind of crazy because like yeah a couple of his friends you know Nathan and

(00:46:13):

Andy who were kind of doing that they they put a lot on the line both of them kind

(00:46:17):

of left their main jobs for a minute and tried it out and you didn’t you’re I

(00:46:22):

didn’t no no no I’m not that dumb yeah they gave me 10% of the company but like

(00:46:28):

Because there were some investors when we went through that accelerator.

(00:46:31):

Janice Tech Forest did pay us.

(00:46:34):

They paid us to purchase the name and the website and everything.

(00:46:38):

But because we owed all this money to these investors, I think I made like $36.

(00:46:43):

Or like $64.

(00:46:44):

I think that’s my exact royalties on my book so far.

(00:46:47):

Yeah, that’s right.

(00:46:48):

That’s like my royalties on my book.

(00:46:50):

But like, yeah, it was like under $100 for sure was my payout.

(00:46:55):

But I guess it’s better than owing something.

(00:46:59):

I bought a lot of flyers.

(00:47:00):

I still do every once in a while.

(00:47:02):

Now I’m a big fan of the Trader Joe’s bouquets.

(00:47:07):

That’s what my wife likes.

(00:47:08):

That’s what the real Megan likes, is buying Trader Joe’s bouquets.

(00:47:11):

Yeah, so I switched to that because...

(00:47:14):

It’s just easier.

(00:47:16):

Yeah.

(00:47:17):

But I did buy a lot.

(00:47:18):

Actually, I don’t know if you knew this or not.

(00:47:20):

Technically, I don’t know how technical it was.

(00:47:22):

Our wedding was done by Zinnia.

(00:47:25):

What?

(00:47:26):

Yeah.

(00:47:27):

I did not remember this.

(00:47:28):

Yeah.

(00:47:29):

So Andy’s wife.

(00:47:31):

Yeah.

(00:47:32):

Which floral arrangement is she?

(00:47:34):

Let me see.

(00:47:37):

I’ve had too many drinks.

(00:47:38):

You’ve had any?

(00:47:41):

Unless you’re counting your Yeti full of wine over there.

(00:47:44):

Yeah.

(00:47:46):

I don’t remember Andy Holtz’s wife’s name.

(00:47:50):

Why am I totally blind?

(00:47:51):

I don’t know.

(00:47:52):

She’s a great woman.

(00:47:52):

I’m sure she still is.

(00:47:53):

You have to delete this out.

(00:47:54):

Yeah.

(00:47:54):

I’m sure she still is.

(00:47:55):

But she was our... Katie.

(00:47:57):

Katie.

(00:47:58):

Yeah, Katie Holtz.

(00:47:59):

The Katie.

(00:48:00):

Sorry, Katie, when you listen to this.

(00:48:01):

Sorry, Katie.

(00:48:02):

I was thinking about my wife so much.

(00:48:03):

Yeah.

(00:48:04):

I know you’re a big fan of this podcast, so you’re probably very upset.

(00:48:08):

So Katie was our wedding coordinator.

(00:48:12):

Oh, yeah.

(00:48:12):

Yeah.

(00:48:12):

So she was working for the church.

(00:48:14):

That was her little gig.

(00:48:16):

She would coordinate weddings.

(00:48:17):

So we got married.

(00:48:18):

And she did all the coordinating.

(00:48:21):

It’s so important.

(00:48:22):

You’ve got to have a coordinator.

(00:48:23):

I didn’t really have a coordinator.

(00:48:24):

It can really help.

(00:48:25):

I really didn’t understand what her job was until I realized all the things that we

(00:48:29):

didn’t know what we were doing.

(00:48:30):

And then we’re like, oh, okay, this is great.

(00:48:33):

And what we were telling her, we’re like, this is its own podcast episode.

(00:48:39):

So we thought we had a hookup through Paige’s dad with the flowers.

(00:48:43):

And so it was just her dad’s always done a bunch of weird

(00:48:47):

By C.S.

(00:48:47):

Beaty

(00:49:07):

But so like we’re we’re just complaining to her about how like well we thought we

(00:49:12):

had a good hookup with a wholesale flower dealer we went to this wholesale flower

(00:49:15):

and we gave the name of the account they said oh that’s not been active for a long

(00:49:19):

time we’re like well thanks thanks future father-in-law

(00:49:23):

So we’re telling Katie the story and if you’re wondering what that background noise

(00:49:27):

is my wife is now getting into the tub above the ceiling above us it’s the running

(00:49:32):

water so Katie she goes well we probably have a wholesale account you can just use

(00:49:38):

ours and we’re like

(00:49:39):

Okay, but then what do we do?

(00:49:42):

And so Katie figured out like one of the, is it Epperson?

(00:49:47):

Emily Epperson?

(00:49:48):

Yeah.

(00:49:49):

She’s another big fan of the podcast.

(00:49:50):

I gotta give her a shout out.

(00:49:52):

Gosh, all these ladies that listen.

(00:49:54):

Yeah, good memory.

(00:49:55):

Wow.

(00:49:55):

Geez, Chris, you were insane.

(00:49:57):

so she was the florist and so she was she designed a lot of those bouquets yeah so

(00:50:01):

we got so katie reached out to her because it was still very like zinni was still a

(00:50:05):

thing yeah reached out to her uh gave us a sweet deal on the uh on everything

(00:50:10):

because they wanted they didn’t know if they wanted to do weddings or not and so

(00:50:13):

like they basically just gave it to us at cost oh my goodness to promote and say we

(00:50:18):

did this wedding and so like you probably ran a lot of stuff on your website or

(00:50:22):

somebody did about my wedding and you know you were actually even there and

(00:50:27):

He had no recollection of this.

(00:50:28):

No, I did not remember.

(00:50:30):

Yeah, so it was like Paige showed me, I think, what did we use, Facebook back then?

(00:50:36):

Yeah, probably.

(00:50:37):

Zinnia Facebook.

(00:50:38):

Yeah.

(00:50:39):

Talked about our wedding and used our wedding as like advertisement of,

(00:50:42):

look at this great wedding game.

(00:50:43):

And it turned out great.

(00:50:44):

I’m going to dig this up.

(00:50:45):

I still have the dead wedding bouquet upstairs.

(00:50:47):

Do you really?

(00:50:48):

Well, I mean, doesn’t everybody keep their wedding bouquet?

(00:50:51):

I guess I don’t.

(00:50:52):

Maybe Meg has it somewhere in storage.

(00:50:55):

My goodness.

(00:50:56):

You have such a good memory.

(00:50:58):

Your marriage isn’t as strong as ours.

(00:50:59):

Apparently not.

(00:51:00):

If I had that dead bouquet, I don’t, man.

(00:51:02):

Yeah.

(00:51:02):

Well, and I actually, my one contribution to our floral arrangement was

(00:51:08):

I was in a wedding where they used silk flowers.

(00:51:10):

Like I was like a groomsman or something.

(00:51:11):

I loved it because I didn’t have to worry about destroying it.

(00:51:14):

And so I said, I want fake flowers for our, what do they call them?

(00:51:17):

Oh, the corsage.

(00:51:18):

Corsage.

(00:51:19):

Is that what it is?

(00:51:20):

Yeah.

(00:51:20):

So I said,

(00:51:20):

I want a fake flower because I said,

(00:51:22):

I don’t want to worry the whole night about,

(00:51:23):

am I going to kill this

(00:51:25):

You know, living thing, this delicate thing.

(00:51:28):

I just want to be able to pick up a kid and swing it.

(00:51:30):

You want something fake just like you.

(00:51:32):

Yes, it was a good metaphor for our marriage.

(00:51:36):

It’s like everything’s been fake up to this point.

(00:51:39):

Why stop now?

(00:51:41):

Okay, so after you started around that time, we’ve already alluded to this, you started a band.

(00:51:46):

You found a really amazing diamond in the rough to be your drummer.

(00:51:50):

You got offered a recording contract and turned it down.

(00:51:54):

That’s true.

(00:51:54):

Some of us wanted to take that deal, by the way.

(00:51:56):

Okay, so remind me of what that was.

(00:51:59):

It’s so funny.

(00:52:00):

Your memory is so much better than mine.

(00:52:02):

When I was reading that in your book and stuff, I’m like, this did happen, but did I...

(00:52:09):

It meant a lot more to him.

(00:52:10):

It meant way more to you than to me, apparently.

(00:52:14):

You were still allowed to play on church worship, so I was clinging on to anything I could.

(00:52:17):

This was it.

(00:52:18):

This was everything for you.

(00:52:19):

But what was that?

(00:52:20):

Was that through Schaefer?

(00:52:22):

Ben Schaefer.

(00:52:22):

Ben Schaefer.

(00:52:23):

Yeah.

(00:52:24):

Okay, now that...

(00:52:25):

I mean, if you phrase it like that, it sounds like a bigger deal than it was.

(00:52:29):

Right.

(00:52:29):

But it was legitimate.

(00:52:31):

Somebody offered to pay us to record a CD.

(00:52:34):

Right.

(00:52:34):

Which is, by definition, a recording contract.

(00:52:36):

That is a recording contract.

(00:52:37):

He did have a...

(00:52:38):

He literally gave you a piece of paper that we reviewed and said something about-

(00:52:42):

Did we review a paper?

(00:52:43):

You might have.

(00:52:44):

He made,

(00:52:45):

because I remember he made a comment about this is a standard deal for whatever,

(00:52:48):

whatever.

(00:52:48):

I don’t know if I ever actually saw a paper, but we, yeah, we had something.

(00:52:52):

I’m like picturing, have you seen the Muppet movie?

(00:52:55):

Well, there’s like 20 of them.

(00:52:56):

No, the original The Muppet movie.

(00:52:58):

I don’t know.

(00:52:59):

You mean The Muppet Christmas Carol?

(00:53:00):

No, no.

(00:53:01):

That’s also good.

(00:53:01):

With Gonzo as Charles Dickens?

(00:53:03):

I’ve seen that one.

(00:53:04):

The Muppet movie from like 1970, whatever.

(00:53:06):

The first one where they’re trying to go to Hollywood and break into movies.

(00:53:10):

And the very end

(00:53:11):

They come up to Orson Welles.

(00:53:13):

He’s in the studio in Hollywood.

(00:53:16):

He’s got a big beard.

(00:53:17):

You’re supposed to know who this is.

(00:53:18):

Yeah, he turns around.

(00:53:18):

It’s a cameo, and it’s like Orson Welles.

(00:53:21):

And they say, hey, we’re here to become rich and famous or whatever.

(00:53:25):

And he just stares at them like he’s going to fire them.

(00:53:28):

And then he just pushes down the intercom button for the receptionist and is like,

(00:53:33):

prepare the standard rich and famous contract for Kermit the Frog and

(00:53:41):

He was the Orson Welles in that situation.

(00:53:44):

Yeah, and you...

(00:53:45):

Turned it on down.

(00:53:47):

And you, like the Muppet that you are, didn’t understand what was going on.

(00:53:50):

I was basically Gonzo.

(00:53:51):

Yeah.

(00:53:51):

Yeah, well, it’s so funny.

(00:53:52):

So,

(00:53:52):

yeah,

(00:53:54):

like I said before,

(00:53:54):

I was super into music when I was living in Hawaii,

(00:53:58):

and I started writing songs when I was,

(00:54:00):

like,

(00:54:01):

14.

(00:54:01):

Most of them were love songs about that girl that I wanted to marry.

(00:54:04):

But, like, you know, I kind of went from...

(00:54:08):

Just classical music to like,

(00:54:10):

yeah,

(00:54:10):

writing a lot of my own songs,

(00:54:12):

started teaching myself guitar,

(00:54:13):

stuff like that.

(00:54:15):

And I always like wanted to be in a band,

(00:54:17):

you know,

(00:54:18):

but like I always also,

(00:54:20):

you know,

(00:54:20):

felt like my stuff wasn’t good enough or like I was afraid of what people would

(00:54:23):

think or I just felt self-conscious that people would,

(00:54:28):

I don’t know,

(00:54:29):

because I wrote all the songs that they would think I’m controlling.

(00:54:33):

I don’t know, I just, I was afraid of, are you playing our music right now?

(00:54:39):

Can they hear this?

(00:54:40):

I don’t know.

(00:54:40):

I don’t know how these podcasts work.

(00:54:43):

For those of you that aren’t on the video pod,

(00:54:44):

we’re now playing track number 10,

(00:54:47):

Jingle Jingle America by Ben Looters from This Battle album from Piano Frog

(00:54:54):

Records.

(00:54:54):

There you go.

(00:54:55):

Totally made up record label, by the way.

(00:54:58):

Just like my made up book.

(00:54:59):

That’s right.

(00:55:00):

Fake just like your corsage.

(00:55:02):

Yep.

(00:55:05):

I haven’t listened to this in a long time.

(00:55:06):

I’ve never.

(00:55:07):

I’ve actually never listened.

(00:55:08):

So I remember being.

(00:55:09):

This is actually a good one to start with.

(00:55:11):

Yeah.

(00:55:12):

I don’t know how to use my CD player ever.

(00:55:13):

So we started either.

(00:55:14):

So we started track 10.

(00:55:15):

I remember being at a. I don’t even know.

(00:55:17):

We were talking about the why you started a band.

(00:55:20):

But I remember at a. I should probably say I was the drummer at this band.

(00:55:23):

I don’t know if that was actually stated.

(00:55:25):

And I was at a rehearsal digging through all your.

(00:55:27):

We were at the Fruitful Design office.

(00:55:30):

Yep.

(00:55:30):

And I was very bored.

(00:55:32):

Like I usually am in rehearsal.

(00:55:33):

By C.S.

(00:55:34):

Beaty

(00:55:54):

I have another couple boxes of these if you want to give them to all your friends.

(00:55:57):

All my podcasts.

(00:55:59):

So,

(00:55:59):

like and subscribe and send me an email and we will send you a complimentary album

(00:56:04):

of Jingle...

(00:56:05):

No,

(00:56:05):

This Battle by Ben Looters.

(00:56:08):

That’s right.

(00:56:09):

Yeah, it’s crazy.

(00:56:12):

I started writing, like, some of these songs I wrote when I was quite young.

(00:56:15):

This album I put together myself didn’t master it or anything.

(00:56:20):

It’s kind of poorly recorded, but...

(00:56:23):

I recorded it mainly when I was like 19, 20, 21.

(00:56:27):

I think something like that.

(00:56:30):

And it’s so hard for me to talk with this playing

(00:56:37):

But uh anyways yeah like I always like wanted to be in a band or start a band but

(00:56:44):

lacked the self-confidence I guess and so after I got married and I had a few kids

(00:56:50):

and I just like felt like gosh I need to do this or I’m gonna regret it kind of a

(00:56:54):

thing um now I wish I had done it when I was younger probably but then I guess I

(00:56:58):

probably would have started one with you no we were not friends when you were you

(00:57:02):

had way better friends back then you got right

(00:57:05):

It’s true.

(00:57:06):

Well,

(00:57:06):

it’s funny because what I ended up doing is I sent out,

(00:57:09):

it was the most insecure way to start a band.

(00:57:12):

So the funny thing, I don’t think you were in the original message.

(00:57:14):

No, I wasn’t.

(00:57:15):

I remember how I got asked.

(00:57:16):

Yeah, I blasted out, yeah, it’s in your book.

(00:57:19):

I blasted out a message to a handful of music friends.

(00:57:23):

So basically the other thing that happened was

(00:57:26):

In Hawaii, I didn’t have that many really good music friends.

(00:57:28):

I was like the big fish in a small pond where I grew up.

(00:57:31):

A small ocean in Hawaii.

(00:57:34):

Pacific Ocean.

(00:57:35):

There is not a lot going on there.

(00:57:38):

Man, I was leading worship in our small towns.

(00:57:40):

I literally think it was everyone but me.

(00:58:09):

You didn’t cross my mind when I thought of all the talented musicians I knew.

(00:58:14):

Luckily they all turned you down.

(00:58:16):

You were a later addition because I blasted this thing out to everyone that I knew.

(00:58:21):

I was like, hey, anyone want to start a band with me playing my songs basically?

(00:58:26):

And yeah, it was like Lucy, Whitney, and Aaron.

(00:58:29):

Did Dan right away?

(00:58:32):

I feel like Dan was a later addition as well.

(00:58:36):

So him and I were at the same first rehearsal.

(00:58:38):

Yeah, that’s right.

(00:58:39):

So it was just these three girls came forward.

(00:58:42):

And it was a little bit weird.

(00:58:43):

I’d actually been teaching Lucy, not piano, but teaching her songwriting at the 402.

(00:58:49):

I was a piano teacher, but she was good at piano, but wanted some help with songwriting.

(00:58:53):

So I actually knew some of the songs we ended up doing

(00:58:56):

I knew because I helped her in songwriting and teaching.

(00:59:01):

Composing.

(00:59:02):

And she was really good.

(00:59:03):

So that’s why I included her in it.

(00:59:05):

But it was kind of an interesting thing where basically these three single girls

(00:59:10):

said they were available.

(00:59:12):

And we were not.

(00:59:13):

Yeah.

(00:59:14):

By C.S.

(00:59:14):

Beaty

(00:59:34):

She was my first employee at my design firm.

(00:59:38):

So she was also a designer.

(00:59:39):

She did the Zinnia logo with me, like I mentioned.

(00:59:42):

And so she was like this known entity.

(00:59:44):

Whitney was her roommate.

(00:59:45):

And again, Lucy was someone that I had been teaching and I had known for years as well.

(00:59:49):

And so we did I think only one show where it was just me and these three girls.

(00:59:54):

Yep, I was there.

(00:59:55):

Yeah, so you were there.

(00:59:57):

Had I already asked you to be in the band to come and listen?

(00:59:59):

To come and listen, yeah.

(01:00:01):

That’s right.

(01:00:02):

So Chris played drums off and on at my church.

(01:00:06):

I was very off and on.

(01:00:07):

And it was one Sunday.

(01:00:09):

The one that I was on.

(01:00:10):

Yeah.

(01:00:11):

He had played this Sunday.

(01:00:12):

And I was like, oh, man.

(01:00:14):

He sounds just desperate enough that he might say yes.

(01:00:17):

Clearly.

(01:00:18):

I can’t believe these good drummers.

(01:00:20):

Clearly.

(01:00:21):

Because that’s the thing.

(01:00:22):

You actually asked, I think, every one of the other drummers that was playing at our church.

(01:00:27):

And then it was literally the one time I had played.

(01:00:31):

This guy.

(01:00:32):

He’s going nowhere.

(01:00:34):

I don’t know if we really talked about where my headspace was at.

(01:00:37):

I remember walking out of there feeling like garbage.

(01:00:41):

Absolute garbage.

(01:00:42):

It was a real bad experience.

(01:00:44):

It’s another podcast.

(01:00:47):

It’s something I still have a lot of resentment towards.

(01:00:50):

The people that were involved in some of those things.

(01:00:52):

I had always played the drums and been very...

(01:00:56):

I thought I was good, at least, you know, good enough to play in the venues that I did.

(01:00:59):

We were both living on islands.

(01:01:00):

We were both living on islands.

(01:01:02):

Both big fish and small pond.

(01:01:03):

Yeah,

(01:01:03):

and so then I go and I play this one time on a trial basis,

(01:01:06):

and it was very clearly communicated to me,

(01:01:10):

you do not have the gig.

(01:01:11):

Like, it was very clearly, you were only filling in, we do not want you doing this full time.

(01:01:17):

And I didn’t think it went particularly well.

(01:01:20):

I also thought it went well enough for me to not be treated that way.

(01:01:24):

I was in this weird headspace.

(01:01:25):

I got no positive feedback from anyone.

(01:01:28):

It was awful.

(01:01:29):

I walk out.

(01:01:30):

I didn’t know you at the time.

(01:01:33):

I knew who you were.

(01:01:35):

I knew of you.

(01:01:37):

You were in the band.

(01:01:38):

The band that I wanted to be in.

(01:01:39):

Playing the piano and stuff.

(01:01:41):

I remember walking out and you saying

(01:01:43):

You were talking to your little group of friends, probably Jacob, the videographer.

(01:01:48):

Yeah, probably Jacob.

(01:01:51):

You just literally went, hey, you ever thought about being in a band?

(01:01:53):

I was like,

(01:01:54):

Zacchaeus,

(01:01:55):

you come down,

(01:01:56):

because I’m coming to your house today,

(01:01:58):

is what I said,

(01:01:59):

I think.

(01:02:00):

You very much over-spiritualized the whole thing.

(01:02:02):

Yeah, it was weird.

(01:02:03):

But it was such a weird... For me, it was such...

(01:02:06):

I don’t know if I’ve ever told you how meaningful it was to me because I was just

(01:02:11):

in a bad spot and then you saying that was like really like this one guy who I

(01:02:16):

really respect and like at least musically I didn’t know if I knew respect to use a

(01:02:19):

person yet I hadn’t disappointed you not yet you’re very much on the fence

(01:02:25):

But the jury was very much out.

(01:02:27):

And then you just asked,

(01:02:29):

kind of sight unseen,

(01:02:30):

like this small little five song worship set where I got zero positive feedback

(01:02:34):

from anyone,

(01:02:35):

including the people that were kind of obligated by God to encourage me.

(01:02:39):

And then I was like, this dude wanted me to be in a band after this one thing.

(01:02:43):

And then I went and I remember you invited me and said,

(01:02:46):

hey,

(01:02:46):

you know,

(01:02:46):

you don’t got to commit to anything,

(01:02:47):

but come,

(01:02:47):

we’re doing this show.

(01:02:48):

And you called yourself Ben and Friends because- Oh, that’s what we never named.

(01:02:51):

You made it up.

(01:02:52):

I think you literally made it up.

(01:02:57):

It was like a real contender to be the name of the band for a while.

(01:03:00):

We’re like, let’s just go with that.

(01:03:01):

I forgot we didn’t have that.

(01:03:03):

We’d spent a long time figuring out the name.

(01:03:05):

I remember the conversation.

(01:03:06):

You did not want it to be your name and something else.

(01:03:10):

That was the whole thing.

(01:03:11):

I’ve always wanted that.

(01:03:13):

Which I think the name of our band was so cool.

(01:03:15):

It was cool.

(01:03:16):

You invited me.

(01:03:17):

I remember listening to the music being like, this is awesome.

(01:03:21):

Legitimately like, okay, I want to be a part of this.

(01:03:22):

I didn’t know anybody but you.

(01:03:24):

But just the total quality was definitely there.

(01:03:27):

I could tell you guys had something.

(01:03:29):

And then I go to the very first rehearsal, and that’s when Dan comes.

(01:03:32):

And I knew Dan from some engineering classes.

(01:03:35):

Oh, you already knew him?

(01:03:36):

I knew of him.

(01:03:37):

We had taken some classes.

(01:03:38):

He was a familiar face.

(01:03:39):

Jeez, I forgot about that.

(01:03:40):

And we did that thing where we both looked at each other and went like, hey, Chris?

(01:03:45):

Dan?

(01:03:45):

Yeah.

(01:03:47):

Teacher’s pet.

(01:03:47):

Yeah.

(01:03:49):

You’re the guy in the engineering classes with long hair.

(01:03:52):

Yeah, you’re the guy that talks too much.

(01:03:54):

Yeah.

(01:03:55):

And then it was just it was like it felt like if any musician that could probably

(01:03:59):

relate to that feeling just like it felt like like that lightning in a bottle kind

(01:04:02):

of thing like that that moment where just it just do you remember what Dan was

(01:04:06):

playing though he wasn’t playing bass you but it was discussed it was like yeah you

(01:04:10):

said well Dan or you or him or whatever it’s like Dan’s a really good guitar player

(01:04:15):

but we actually need a bass and Dan said

(01:04:17):

I kind of want to learn how to play the bass.

(01:04:18):

Right, he didn’t know how to play.

(01:04:19):

He never played.

(01:04:20):

He learned for the band.

(01:04:21):

Literally, I got a bass and learned how to play bass.

(01:04:23):

But I think about it because we actually have recordings from that first practice

(01:04:28):

where he’s playing electric guitar.

(01:04:29):

That’s the only time we ever had electric guitar in our band was in that practice that one time.

(01:04:33):

And it was kind of cool.

(01:04:34):

He did some different stuff.

(01:04:36):

It would have completely changed the sound, but we did need a bass.

(01:04:38):

And he ended up really bringing the bass.

(01:04:40):

The vibe would have been so much different.

(01:04:41):

Because if you listen to any of his, I mean, fans of the pod know...

(01:04:47):

speak loud and advocate recordings that I drop into without any plan whatsoever

(01:04:52):

drop them into random podcasts I mean yeah that stuff is so much different than the

(01:04:57):

Cavalier it’s not melodic I mean his stuff is like he’s so out there it’s like

(01:05:01):

weird and experimental I think he would describe it that way too versus like the

(01:05:05):

Cavaliers are like melodic and building and like dramatic dramatic yeah it was kind

(01:05:11):

of a cool band I’m not gonna lie like I had a lot of fun doing it I don’t need a

(01:05:15):

lie

(01:05:16):

It was like,

(01:05:17):

well,

(01:05:18):

it’s fun because in the end,

(01:05:19):

you know,

(01:05:20):

at first I was like,

(01:05:20):

oh,

(01:05:20):

this is going to all be my music,

(01:05:22):

but it wasn’t.

(01:05:22):

You know, Lucy wrote a good handful of the songs and even led some of the songs.

(01:05:29):

There was shared leadership and

(01:05:32):

Even our single was actually Lucy’s song.

(01:05:35):

And Dan really brought the bass on that.

(01:05:38):

And you brought the drums.

(01:05:39):

It was a lot of fun.

(01:05:41):

I learned so much through that experience.

(01:05:45):

But it was hard.

(01:05:46):

It’s just crazy.

(01:05:47):

You were the only married person.

(01:05:49):

I was the only married person when we started.

(01:05:51):

You were the band leader by far.

(01:05:52):

You were the person with all the connections to everything.

(01:05:55):

And I’m starting a business at the same time.

(01:05:57):

And I’m having my third kid.

(01:05:59):

I was just in the wrong time of life to be trying to do this thing.

(01:06:05):

It was hard.

(01:06:06):

I’m glad I did it, but I just learned a lot about my own limitations during that time.

(01:06:14):

I’m really proud of the music.

(01:06:15):

I think about it all the time.

(01:06:16):

I listen to the few recordings I have.

(01:06:20):

all the time.

(01:06:20):

I think they still sound so good.

(01:06:22):

That single sounds so good, Hide and Seek.

(01:06:27):

And it’s like, man.

(01:06:29):

So who knows?

(01:06:29):

Maybe someday.

(01:06:30):

It was a weird thing to be a part of and think,

(01:06:32):

like,

(01:06:33):

I had been in a lot of bands and known they were bad.

(01:06:35):

Like, I feel like that’s... Maybe you’ve never had that experience.

(01:06:38):

See, I never had that, really.

(01:06:39):

Worship bands, and I was in worship bands, especially in Hawaii, that were like

(01:06:44):

they were really rough again like I was in situations where I was young and the

(01:06:49):

best person on the band and I wasn’t that good like you know what I mean it was

(01:06:52):

like there was this one guy I don’t want to call him he’s probably passed away he

(01:06:56):

was older playing drums and it was the first drummer we ever had in our church in

(01:07:00):

Hawaii because we were very conservative and like drums were a little bit of the

(01:07:03):

devil yeah which I’m sure you’re very familiar with yeah they still are but he oh

(01:07:09):

poor guy I’ll never forget it what’s this the song is is it

(01:07:14):

He is exalted forever exalted.

(01:07:16):

Is that the one?

(01:07:17):

Oh lord, yeah.

(01:07:18):

But he did a completely different, it was Easter Sunday.

(01:07:21):

Yeah, because that’s a 6-8.

(01:07:22):

That’s a tricky tempo.

(01:07:23):

He just started doing a 4-4 tempo and we’re like, oh no, buddy.

(01:07:27):

Oh, no, buddy.

(01:07:28):

But it was one of those things where- It changes everything.

(01:07:33):

Trying to do the right thing.

(01:07:35):

Oh, it was a train wreck that never righted itself.

(01:07:39):

And it was Easter Sunday morning.

(01:07:41):

It was like I’m back there just like tears in my eyes.

(01:07:45):

Not from the Holy Spirit.

(01:07:46):

No, no, no, no, no.

(01:07:47):

This was bad.

(01:07:48):

And so like that was like the worst.

(01:07:51):

I went through some really rough stuff then.

(01:07:53):

But yeah, being in our band, it was a lot of fun.

(01:07:57):

We had a lot of fun.

(01:07:59):

Listening to the banter and some of the recordings, we were having a blast.

(01:08:03):

It was good music.

(01:08:04):

I think that’s a weird feeling for me, being in all these shitty screamo bands.

(01:08:10):

I can scream.

(01:08:11):

Do you want me to scream?

(01:08:13):

Not this time.

(01:08:14):

We’re already over an hour on this.

(01:08:15):

Oh gosh, yeah.

(01:08:16):

This is going to be a three-parter right here.

(01:08:18):

It is, yeah.

(01:08:20):

So, next time on

(01:08:23):

And we’re back.

(01:08:25):

Yeah,

(01:08:26):

it was like,

(01:08:26):

there was this moment,

(01:08:27):

like,

(01:08:28):

several times,

(01:08:28):

like,

(01:08:28):

where it’s like,

(01:08:29):

you know,

(01:08:30):

the cliches,

(01:08:30):

the pinch yourself moment,

(01:08:31):

but just like,

(01:08:32):

I remember being very aware,

(01:08:33):

like,

(01:08:33):

this is actually good.

(01:08:35):

Like, this is actually good.

(01:08:36):

Like, it’s something where, like, Thank you.

(01:08:38):

Well, I was a part of it.

(01:08:39):

I was a part of it, too.

(01:08:40):

Yeah, that’s true.

(01:08:41):

I’m saying, I was also good.

(01:08:43):

Oh, I thought you meant Ben and Friends.

(01:08:44):

Oh, yeah, Cavalier was fine, too.

(01:08:45):

No, I mean, you were fine, but me, too.

(01:08:47):

I wasn’t like, you know, I guess.

(01:08:49):

Hey, we have to say where the name came from, though.

(01:08:50):

Okay, the Cavalier.

(01:08:51):

The Cavalier.

(01:08:52):

Okay, you say it.

(01:08:53):

Well,

(01:08:53):

I mean,

(01:08:54):

so we started all the practices in my office in downtown Benson,

(01:09:00):

Nebraska,

(01:09:01):

which is this old historic area and this old historic building.

(01:09:06):

And at the time,

(01:09:08):

my office,

(01:09:09):

the Fruitful Design Office,

(01:09:11):

and the 402 Arts Collective,

(01:09:13):

they were kind of rehabbing this old building.

(01:09:15):

And in the building was this old barbershop called The Cavalier,

(01:09:19):

which,

(01:09:20):

in fact,

(01:09:20):

I don’t even know if you know this,

(01:09:21):

but my grandpa used to get his hair cut there.

(01:09:23):

So my grandpa,

(01:09:25):

my mom’s dad,

(01:09:26):

used to tell me stories about going to get his hair cut at the Cavalier when he was

(01:09:30):

younger.

(01:09:32):

But it had this cool

(01:09:34):

You know, painted sign of the Cavalier.

(01:09:37):

It was a giant mural on the side of this brick wall.

(01:09:39):

Yeah, on the side of the brick wall.

(01:09:40):

And so as we were like exploring different cool indie hipster sounding names,

(01:09:46):

this somehow made it on that list.

(01:09:48):

It was literally something where I remember we had a long list and then we’re all

(01:09:53):

like,

(01:09:53):

and the Cavalier wasn’t on it.

(01:09:55):

It was like we had the, you know, what’s the name of the band meeting?

(01:09:59):

and there’s this long list and you had like this you know note on your phone if

(01:10:02):

that technology existed yeah you’re using some hipster app um that was Evernote or

(01:10:07):

something yeah for something something that I didn’t know how to use uh and and

(01:10:11):

we’re like going on from we’re all just kind of like no not that wasn’t really

(01:10:14):

right it was literally I don’t know probably you but somebody just went what about

(01:10:17):

the Cavalier and we went yes yeah like it was like this weird moment where we’re

(01:10:21):

just like that is the name and it was like a movie and we had to keep on then we

(01:10:24):

had to fight everyone wanted to call us the Cavaliers which yeah oh yeah the

(01:10:28):

Clevelands

(01:10:28):

We’re only one.

(01:10:29):

There’s only one of us.

(01:10:31):

We’re a collective of the Cavalier.

(01:10:33):

The Cavalier.

(01:10:36):

We’re the Cavalier,

(01:10:37):

which was actually misleading because I’m pretty sure the mural just said Cavalier.

(01:10:41):

Yeah, it just said Cavalier, but people called it the Cavalier.

(01:10:43):

And that was at a time when everything I branded,

(01:10:45):

I put a the,

(01:10:46):

because there’s also the 402 Arts Collective,

(01:10:49):

which I’ve actually rebranded them as just 402 Arts Collective.

(01:10:52):

So I was putting the before.

(01:10:54):

I can’t believe I wasn’t the Fruitful Design.

(01:10:57):

I should have been.

(01:10:58):

You would have done a lot.

(01:10:59):

You probably wouldn’t be in your mom’s basement.

(01:11:00):

I probably wouldn’t.

(01:11:03):

I’d be in your basement.

(01:11:05):

Doing a podcast to zero listeners.

(01:11:09):

Well, yes, the recording contract, I remember you, so Benjamin Schaefer, does he go by Benjamin?

(01:11:14):

Yeah, sometimes we distinguish our names that way.

(01:11:16):

Okay, so Benjamin, that sounds business-y, not you.

(01:11:20):

Ben Schaefer, owner of the 402 Arts Collective, because it wasn’t rebanded.

(01:11:26):

He offered to pay for us to record an album, a full album, and we thought about it.

(01:11:32):

But at that time,

(01:11:33):

the momentum was kind of dying,

(01:11:35):

and we had actually tried to record on our own,

(01:11:38):

and it was literally just Dan,

(01:11:40):

our bass player,

(01:11:41):

and me doing the drum tracks.

(01:11:44):

We recorded all the drums.

(01:11:45):

Does that still exist?

(01:11:46):

Dan lost the files.

(01:11:49):

We recorded a few more of them.

(01:11:51):

I don’t know why we think you’re the loser in the band.

(01:11:53):

It’s really Dan for doing that.

(01:11:54):

I didn’t know we thought that about me.

(01:11:56):

I’m sorry.

(01:11:57):

Inside words.

(01:11:58):

Inside words.

(01:12:00):

I’ve known it was Dan.

(01:12:02):

You

(01:12:03):

So he loses the files.

(01:12:05):

And it’s like very classic Dan.

(01:12:07):

He’s like, I don’t know what happened.

(01:12:08):

I don’t know.

(01:12:08):

I don’t know what happened.

(01:12:09):

I’m like, we spent a lot of time.

(01:12:11):

And it was a we thing.

(01:12:12):

It was a him and me.

(01:12:13):

So it wasn’t just me.

(01:12:14):

It was both of us.

(01:12:15):

And I know he spent time trying to tweak it and stuff.

(01:12:18):

Because I had like scratch tracks that you guys were playing with.

(01:12:20):

Yeah.

(01:12:21):

I mean, we had some stuff.

(01:12:22):

But we did the entire album on drums.

(01:12:25):

And it was a full 10 song album.

(01:12:26):

And then we’re like, maybe we’ll just do an EP.

(01:12:28):

I’m like, I already did the whole thing, guys.

(01:12:30):

and then he lost a bunch so we re-recorded them and then he’s lost them again like

(01:12:33):

I’ve asked him and he still doesn’t know where they are and then but around that

(01:12:36):

sad I’ve always like kind of like hoped that they still maybe I’m sure they still

(01:12:40):

do just Dan doesn’t know where they are doesn’t mean they don’t exist that’s true

(01:12:44):

so around that time Ben Schafer offers to pay to like I mean he and to clarify like

(01:12:49):

he owned the studio we were working at so it would have just been using the

(01:12:52):

equipment we’re already using and just having like more of an incentive to actually

(01:12:55):

do it and he paid for our single

(01:12:57):

Did he?

(01:12:58):

Yeah, he paid for our single.

(01:13:00):

Man, Chris, your memory is so freaking good.

(01:13:02):

Yeah, well, that was the highlight of my life.

(01:13:05):

And then come to the next part of the story.

(01:13:07):

And then we get offered this recording contract that was a real recording contract,

(01:13:11):

but not by a label,

(01:13:13):

by this guy that owned this nonprofit.

(01:13:15):

And you definitely did not want to take it.

(01:13:18):

I did, but we made a decision.

(01:13:21):

And it wasn’t just you either.

(01:13:22):

I think we were pretty split.

(01:13:24):

Yeah, I think it was like half and half.

(01:13:25):

It was very much half and half.

(01:13:26):

And I think I definitely understood why we did it.

(01:13:30):

And we already kind of explained just phase of life.

(01:13:32):

We were in a totally different phase of life than the rest of us.

(01:13:34):

But it was a weird thing because it was definitely a moment where we were part of

(01:13:40):

something that was really cool.

(01:13:41):

Right.

(01:13:42):

And then it was just like, all right, well, it was cool.

(01:13:45):

But there’s something else that we’re going to be doing now.

(01:13:48):

Not even like the grass is green or something else is better.

(01:13:50):

It’s going to come along.

(01:13:50):

Just like this cool thing is not going to happen.

(01:13:53):

It’s not going to happen.

(01:13:54):

And that doesn’t mean it wasn’t cool, but it’s just not going to happen.

(01:13:57):

And so I guess we’ll move on, you know?

(01:13:59):

Yeah.

(01:13:59):

It kind of sucked.

(01:14:00):

It does kind of suck, doesn’t it?

(01:14:02):

So to put you on the spot, so we’re going to start a new band.

(01:14:06):

Well, didn’t you guys, like some of you, continue to do a band for a second.

(01:14:09):

It was not very good.

(01:14:11):

What was it called?

(01:14:11):

It had a funny name.

(01:14:12):

Polar Bear Opposites.

(01:14:13):

Okay, I was like, it had a bear in it.

(01:14:14):

It wasn’t that it was bad.

(01:14:15):

It was just it was a bunch of us goofing around, you know?

(01:14:17):

Okay, okay.

(01:14:18):

So the theme song to this podcast is actually one of the Polar Bear Opposite recordings.

(01:14:22):

Is it really?

(01:14:23):

Yeah, if you listen to any As Told By C.S.

(01:14:26):

Beaty, Empire.

(01:14:27):

That’s Polar Bear.

(01:14:29):

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(01:14:30):

I’ll play it right now in the edit.

(01:14:32):

See, now it’s going in the edit.

(01:14:34):

It’s going to be going.

(01:14:35):

This song.

(01:14:36):

And that’s Polar Bear Opposite.

(01:14:37):

That was one of the Polar Bear Opposite recordings.

(01:14:39):

We had this really long.

(01:14:40):

I guess it would be a bridge,

(01:14:44):

but that was back when Breakdowns were really cool,

(01:14:47):

which was like a hardcore bridge as a breakdown.

(01:14:49):

It wasn’t a breakdown, but it was just like, let’s have this long bridge.

(01:14:51):

We had a cool breakdown in Hide and Seek.

(01:14:52):

We did.

(01:14:53):

Yeah, that was the way the drums kicked in.

(01:14:55):

Yeah, that was so cool, dude.

(01:14:57):

Yep.

(01:14:57):

So anyways,

(01:14:58):

yeah,

(01:14:59):

so we did that for a little bit,

(01:15:00):

and then we just kind of all did,

(01:15:01):

like,

(01:15:02):

then I was the guy that went,

(01:15:03):

I’m actually going to start an MBA program,

(01:15:05):

so I don’t think I have time for this.

(01:15:07):

And then we’re like, aw.

(01:15:08):

And then I was the Ben Looters of the polar bear officers.

(01:15:14):

But that was a very it’s very different.

(01:15:15):

But the last time I saw and it’s funny,

(01:15:17):

like I still run into people from our band every once in a while.

(01:15:19):

But the last time I saw Lucy,

(01:15:21):

it was on her plane ride to move to San Diego,

(01:15:25):

which is this crazy.

(01:15:25):

What?

(01:15:26):

She was moving.

(01:15:27):

You have not told me that.

(01:15:28):

She was moving to California.

(01:15:29):

And you saw her on the plane?

(01:15:31):

On the plane while she was moving, which is wild.

(01:15:34):

Yeah.

(01:15:34):

And it was this craziest thing.

(01:15:35):

Like, it was like we did this.

(01:15:36):

I think it might even have been during COVID.

(01:15:37):

I think we might have had masks on.

(01:15:40):

So do you know it was her?

(01:15:42):

Yeah, we pieced it together.

(01:15:43):

We did the triple take, right?

(01:15:44):

Because it’s just the bridge to the nose up.

(01:15:47):

Yeah, would I recognize you if I just saw your creepy eyes?

(01:15:50):

Probably, because you look at pictures of me a lot.

(01:15:53):

That’s true, I do.

(01:15:55):

I hate to admit that.

(01:15:57):

Yeah, you made a lot of money off of that.

(01:15:59):

That’s true.

(01:16:01):

Exactly.

(01:16:02):

More money than I’ve made off of selling my book, I’ll say that.

(01:16:06):

Oh, man.

(01:16:08):

But yeah, I saw her.

(01:16:10):

It was a Southwest flight, so it was back when Southwest still made you the open space.

(01:16:15):

Oh yeah Which just recently changed Yeah so like she sat by In between my wife and

(01:16:19):

I And like we caught up And I don’t even remember Where Paige and I were going But

(01:16:24):

yeah she was on her way Like moving to California It was the craziest thing It was

(01:16:27):

so fun Yeah I think she still is But yeah it was so fun Seeing her for the first

(01:16:31):

time in years And just like This is a person that was like One of my closest

(01:16:35):

friends For that phase of life For that phase of life And now she’s you know Living

(01:16:38):

in a different country Country It might as well be Yeah California We don’t claim

(01:16:42):

California Not like We’re conservatives here Yeah

(01:16:45):

Well,

(01:16:46):

it’s funny,

(01:16:46):

because I also have...

(01:16:48):

You and I have been hanging out more and been working together more,

(01:16:51):

so that’s been fun for me.

(01:16:53):

But then also, I just randomly ran into Whitney over the weekend, Mother’s Day weekend.

(01:16:59):

And she’s a mom now.

(01:17:00):

She has several kids, and she had one of her kids.

(01:17:03):

It was so funny that me and my family ran into her.

(01:17:07):

And then she said...

(01:17:11):

That she just saw me the day before.

(01:17:13):

Yeah, and she had just seen you.

(01:17:14):

It was the first time I had seen her in weeks.

(01:17:16):

I think you were homeless asking for handouts or something.

(01:17:20):

It was a very low point in my life.

(01:17:22):

I was desperately asking anyone to buy my book, and no one did, so I gave Whitney a free copy.

(01:17:27):

You were on the side of the road asking if anyone could figure out how to use this

(01:17:31):

podcast equipment.

(01:17:32):

You’re just holding these cables.

(01:17:35):

It says USB-C is compatible.

(01:17:37):

It says it.

(01:17:39):

There’s all these YouTubers that say it’s so simple.

(01:17:41):

And you don’t even know this Chris but Monday night I don’t think you know this

(01:17:47):

Monday night I show up to Metro Community College to review graphic design

(01:17:51):

portfolios not even thinking about who else might be there but Erin Pilly was one

(01:17:58):

of the designers and I actually hadn’t seen so Erin worked for me for years but she

(01:18:03):

left and she worked at a bunch of other places and now she’s freelancing I haven’t

(01:18:06):

seen Erin in years

(01:18:08):

And it was so cool.

(01:18:09):

We talked and we’re going to be getting lunch this next week.

(01:18:11):

But it’s just kind of fun just thinking about all you guys and running into people

(01:18:16):

and seeing where people are at now.

(01:18:18):

Get the band back together.

(01:18:23):

So, all right.

(01:18:23):

So we’re,

(01:18:24):

I don’t even know how long my podcast is going to be yet,

(01:18:26):

but we’re at,

(01:18:26):

Bob’s was,

(01:18:27):

Uncle Bob’s episode is not this long.

(01:18:28):

All right.

(01:18:29):

So to wrap things up, a few important questions.

(01:18:32):

Who’s your favorite Power Ranger?

(01:18:34):

Oh my goodness.

(01:18:35):

I’m so sheltered, dude.

(01:18:36):

I wasn’t allowed to be in the Power Rangers.

(01:18:38):

All friends were into it and I thought they were like, like forest rangers.

(01:18:42):

Okay.

(01:18:43):

Yeah.

(01:18:43):

I didn’t even know.

(01:18:44):

That explains the purity culture.

(01:18:46):

I would have liked whatever the T-Rex guy.

(01:18:48):

Is that Red?

(01:18:49):

Aren’t they all T-Rex?

(01:18:51):

Is there a guy named Jason?

(01:18:52):

I think.

(01:18:53):

If there is, we’ll go with it.

(01:18:55):

Okay.

(01:18:55):

Okay, so we should probably say something about your book.

(01:18:59):

Ben is the author of Escape from Terikiak.

(01:19:02):

I got a copy right here.

(01:19:03):

Oh my gosh, you just pulled it out.

(01:19:05):

He also has a shrine to my book right behind me.

(01:19:09):

You’re not supposed to say, oh my gosh, you just pulled it out without

(01:19:13):

So I do have one of the original prints of Escape from Tariqiak in my basement.

(01:19:22):

Alright, so I’m going to read a little bit of this.

(01:19:24):

Are you actually?

(01:19:25):

I should hire you to do the audiobook version of my book.

(01:19:28):

Alright, so this is from

(01:19:33):

I don’t even know how to say his last name because I don’t even know who that is

(01:19:36):

Nicholas Fredrickson

(01:19:57):

Jonah Gaffner and Ty Franklin I know Ty Naya Charlotte Wyatt Colburn Faye Amory

(01:20:04):

John Ryan and Calvin these aren’t even real names your editor who I know you’ve

(01:20:08):

never met because you’ve told me that and to the creator Jesus Christ are you

(01:20:12):

missing anyone from that list

(01:20:16):

I would thank you now.

(01:20:17):

You’ll probably be in the acknowledgments of the second book.

(01:20:21):

Okay, good.

(01:20:21):

You weren’t as involved in my life at that time.

(01:20:24):

Just because I wasn’t asked.

(01:20:26):

But I will say, kidding aside, thanks for agreeing to put my kids in the next book.

(01:20:29):

They are super excited about it.

(01:20:32):

And I understand you have a big announcement about book two.

(01:20:35):

I am working on book two.

(01:20:37):

And it’s coming out.

(01:20:38):

You’re going to say that right now on this podcast.

(01:20:40):

It’s ready

(01:20:41):

Dude I want to I do really good with like firm deadlines and when I don’t have one

(01:20:46):

it’s so much harder for me to deliver and so like there’s the part of me that’s

(01:20:50):

like dude Ben just say that it’s coming out like the first of the year or something

(01:20:55):

like that like I could do it like I’m almost done with the first draft a little bit

(01:21:01):

of editing I gotta do the illustrations but like I actually really do like it I

(01:21:06):

think it’s a better I think it’s gonna be a better more interesting book than the

(01:21:09):

first one

(01:21:10):

And um yeah more interesting it does some interesting stuff I’m excited about it

(01:21:15):

but like with all the stuff going on with my business right now and living in my

(01:21:19):

parents basement it’s just been like uh it’s been on the back burner so I need I

(01:21:24):

need to focus on it okay well we’re gonna turn that heat up I should hire you to

(01:21:28):

finish it man you’re like you are so like prolific when you come to like

(01:21:33):

Dude, you’re able to crank stuff out.

(01:21:36):

I cannot keep up with the output that you do.

(01:21:39):

Yeah, clearly, because you’ve never liked anything.

(01:21:41):

No, I don’t.

(01:21:42):

I mean, I can’t even keep up with...

(01:21:44):

I can’t even pretend to like all the stuff that you do.

(01:21:47):

And you don’t.

(01:21:48):

You don’t even try.

(01:21:50):

Neither does anyone else.

(01:21:51):

Uncle Bob’s a big fan, because he’s done about three quarters of the content.

(01:21:55):

Yeah.

(01:21:58):

Yeah so I actually made the mistake I’m writing a book with my aunt and I made the

(01:22:03):

mistake of reading some of it a little bit ago and I went this is really boring so

(01:22:07):

now I’m actually like very depressed about it.

(01:22:09):

Are you really?

(01:22:10):

I mean not overall like the project is like I know I know the content’s good you

(01:22:14):

know like I know the content’s really good but I had this moment where I’m reading

(01:22:17):

some of it thinking like it’s just not there yet and I think like I don’t know if

(01:22:21):

you ever felt that way it’s like writing stuff it’s like

(01:22:24):

It’s not there.

(01:22:25):

I think it will be there.

(01:22:25):

I don’t know how it’s going to get there.

(01:22:27):

And it’s just like this crushing feeling of, oh boy.

(01:22:31):

I thought I would nail it on the first draft.

(01:22:33):

It would be perfect.

(01:22:34):

And I could just make a million dollars.

(01:22:37):

and I guess that’s not how it works see that’s funny like I mean gosh yeah Chris

(01:22:44):

Beaty wrote a book called Loser C.S.

(01:22:46):

Beaty C.S.

(01:22:47):

Beaty oh I’m so sorry I keep on getting so casual with you Clive Staples Beaty

(01:22:51):

Clive Staples Beaty wrote a book called Loser but like it’s so funny you’re such a

(01:22:57):

freaking good writer and all the stuff that I do read which has only been like two

(01:23:00):

things you’ve ever posted you’re really a really good writer

(01:23:05):

But like, yeah, I’ve had that feeling before where like, either, I’ve had it both ways.

(01:23:10):

I’ve had it ways where I’m like, oh man, this is going to be awesome.

(01:23:14):

And then I go back to it, I’m like, what was I smoking?

(01:23:17):

Like, what is, oh, we’ve got a long way to go or no one can ever know about this.

(01:23:22):

And then I had the other way where I’m like,

(01:23:23):

gosh,

(01:23:24):

this thing,

(01:23:25):

I was feeling about,

(01:23:25):

I was feeling this way about book two.

(01:23:28):

Because I’d gotten out of it for a while.

(01:23:29):

I’m like, does this even make sense?

(01:23:32):

What the crap?

(01:23:33):

No one’s going to care.

(01:23:34):

It’s all so... And then I started from the beginning and started rereading it.

(01:23:38):

I’m like,

(01:23:39):

Okay, this is actually pretty good.

(01:23:42):

I’m getting back into it.

(01:23:43):

It’s not there yet.

(01:23:45):

There’s some things that need to be cleaned up.

(01:23:47):

Particularly,

(01:23:48):

I’m dealing with multiple timelines and following more characters in the next book.

(01:23:54):

While I was writing it, I was confusing myself.

(01:23:58):

That’s not easy at all.

(01:24:01):

I’m like, okay, I’ve got to untangle some of this, but I think I recently...

(01:24:05):

By C.S.

(01:24:05):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:07):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:07):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:07):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:08):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:08):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:08):

Beaty C.S.

(01:24:24):

You’re an interesting writer I mean I mainly just read your book but like you know

(01:24:29):

it’s like obviously it’s like you’re telling true stories and it’s autobiographical

(01:24:33):

obviously but you know you have this like ability Chris of like the balance of

(01:24:39):

obviously the humor and

(01:24:41):

The humor and the heart you know like you’re able to tell these these things and

(01:24:46):

there’s there’s things that you deal with in the book too that are really yeah

(01:24:51):

powerful and poignant and you deal with serious stuff but then you also have this

(01:24:55):

like I don’t know it’s just such a cool balance that you have whereas like I don’t

(01:25:02):

know writing a fiction book I’d be interested to see you try to write like a

(01:25:05):

fiction I don’t know if I can well I

(01:25:07):

If you’ve written some fiction, you would know if you actually read your newsletters.

(01:25:12):

It is a different part of the brain.

(01:25:13):

And that’s part of what I’m struggling about writing.

(01:25:15):

The next episode,

(01:25:16):

you should just have me on and force me to read all the stuff that you’re always...

(01:25:19):

Man,

(01:25:20):

you’re...

(01:25:20):

Again,

(01:25:20):

you’re so prolific,

(01:25:21):

dude.

(01:25:21):

You post so much stuff.

(01:25:23):

I wish I had that much in me.

(01:25:25):

Yeah, well, I wish I did too.

(01:25:28):

But it is different.

(01:25:29):

So I’m writing...

(01:25:30):

The book that I’m writing now is very different because I’m writing about my aunt

(01:25:33):

and I’m trying to

(01:25:34):

By C.S.

(01:25:35):

Beaty

(01:25:49):

And I just kind of got very discouraged because I just read a list of facts because

(01:25:52):

that’s what it was.

(01:25:53):

I was taking all this information.

(01:25:54):

You can come and embellish that later, right?

(01:25:56):

Absolutely.

(01:25:56):

And that’s the thing.

(01:25:57):

AI can do that.

(01:25:57):

I know.

(01:25:58):

And it’s like, all I need to do is put it in chat GPT and it’ll be fixed.

(01:26:02):

But it’s just, when stuff’s not perfect the first time, it’s just very frustrating.

(01:26:05):

So anyways, I’ve gotten over that a little bit.

(01:26:08):

And yeah, thanks for making the last part of the podcast about me.

(01:26:12):

That’s the goal, man.

(01:26:13):

That’s the goal.

(01:26:14):

All right, Ben, any other parting thoughts before?

(01:26:17):

I do have a gift for you.

(01:26:18):

Oh, no.

(01:26:19):

So as the honorary podcast guest, you have your pick.

(01:26:24):

So you can either take the collector’s series DVD of Jumanji or the regular DVD of

(01:26:30):

Jumanji because I accidentally bought two.

(01:26:33):

Not knowing that we already had one.

(01:26:34):

So you can pick one.

(01:26:35):

It’s the Robin Williams version of Jumanji.

(01:26:37):

Right.

(01:26:38):

I’ve not seen the new Jumanji.

(01:26:41):

Were you allowed to watch this as a kid?

(01:26:42):

So that’s the funny thing.

(01:26:43):

I did not watch this as a kid and I didn’t know why.

(01:26:45):

I was like, this is about animals, whatever.

(01:26:48):

Then I watched it.

(01:26:48):

I’ve only watched this one time and I think it was as an adult and been like,

(01:26:53):

oh,

(01:26:53):

I couldn’t have handled this.

(01:26:54):

Oh, yeah.

(01:26:55):

It’s freaking scary.

(01:26:56):

Because I tried showing it to Jonah, my oldest son, a few years ago.

(01:26:59):

Well, it was more than a few.

(01:27:01):

He was probably like seven or eight.

(01:27:03):

We started it.

(01:27:04):

Does someone start getting sucked into the game right in the beginning?

(01:27:07):

The very first thing is Robin Williams’ character gets sucked into a jungle and

(01:27:12):

he’s lost forever.

(01:27:13):

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(01:27:14):

His entire family thinks he’s dead.

(01:27:16):

I was like, oh, I can’t even handle this.

(01:27:19):

No, it is a messed up movie.

(01:27:22):

Ever since then, I really want to re-watch it.

(01:27:25):

I’m actually pretty excited about this.

(01:27:27):

I’m kind of old school with the DVDs.

(01:27:28):

What are the differences between these?

(01:27:30):

I have no idea.

(01:27:30):

I bought one after I didn’t realize anything.

(01:27:33):

Which one has the least amount of scratches on the actual DVD?

(01:27:36):

Well, you can see I left the $1 tag.

(01:27:39):

Shout out to the Omaha Public Library Friends of the Library sale where I get all my DVDs.

(01:27:44):

This one’s in good shape.

(01:27:47):

Which one’s worth more on eBay?

(01:27:49):

Well, that one is literally $1 according to the Omaha Library.

(01:27:54):

Let me see.

(01:27:55):

This is collector series.

(01:27:58):

I’m going with the collectors because that sounds really fancy and you know me I’m

(01:28:01):

a little on the fancier side I’m excited to watch this dude okay well next time

(01:28:07):

when we have you for the next guest you can tell me tell me if you held up about

(01:28:12):

Jumanji if you’re allowed to watch it now that I’m living in my parents basement I

(01:28:17):

may have to ask them before I can play this you probably should ask for permission

(01:28:22):

Honestly, it might be.

(01:28:23):

I’m looking at literally your Terikiak cover and the Jumanji cover.

(01:28:26):

It’s like the same thing.

(01:28:27):

And also the Jumanji cover is clearly a ripoff of the Jurassic Park cover.

(01:28:33):

Google that.

(01:28:34):

We don’t have a video podcast.

(01:28:35):

Google the Jumanji cover and then the Jurassic Park gate.

(01:28:39):

It is definitely like... Yeah, it’s inspired.

(01:28:41):

I mean,

(01:28:41):

it’s supposed to be like the board with a rhino running through it,

(01:28:44):

but it’s definitely...

(01:28:44):

Can I see this one here?

(01:28:46):

The funny thing about mine is like...

(01:28:49):

Jumanji and Jumanji twice on it.

(01:28:51):

Oh, totally.

(01:28:52):

Again, how is this not a video podcast?

(01:28:54):

Because it’s the collector’s edition.

(01:28:56):

It’s the collector’s, so they have the air.

(01:28:58):

It definitely is a Jumanji Jumanji there.

(01:29:00):

Jumanji Jumanji.

(01:29:02):

That’s the name of this podcast.

(01:29:05):

All right.

(01:29:06):

And on this note, I’m reading your inscription to you.

(01:29:09):

Oh, no.

(01:29:10):

Paige, thanks so much for your encouragement.

(01:29:12):

He made this out to my wife.

(01:29:14):

Also,

(01:29:15):

if you’re curious,

(01:29:16):

this is my daughter has her bookmark in your book and she stopped reading in

(01:29:19):

chapter five,

(01:29:22):

the waves.

(01:29:23):

Seven, I think is where I tell people it gets good.

(01:29:26):

You gotta get through the doldrums.

(01:29:27):

Yeah, you gotta, when’s the, yeah, talking about, I’m

(01:29:36):

This is not going to be a writing podcast.

(01:29:38):

We can’t even describe our own book.

(01:29:40):

Yeah, we don’t need the terminology.

(01:29:42):

I will say in the second book, one of the good things is it just – yeah, there’s no buildup.

(01:29:46):

It just starts in action.

(01:29:48):

In media race.

(01:29:50):

The moment this book ends, it just starts immediately there from a different vantage point.

(01:29:57):

So it’s kind of fun.

(01:29:57):

In that way, there’s not the buildup of –

(01:30:00):

You don’t have to introduce the characters in the same way,

(01:30:02):

but you have to have a little bit of a recap.

(01:30:05):

Remind myself who the characters are.

(01:30:07):

It’s interesting writing.

(01:30:10):

I’ve never really written a book until now,

(01:30:12):

but writing a series of books is interesting because so much of the first book

(01:30:18):

was...

(01:30:18):

We should probably wrap this up because apparently it’s raining pretty hard and

(01:30:21):

your trunk is open.

(01:30:22):

My trunk is open?

(01:30:23):

Yeah, according to my wife.

(01:30:25):

Seriously?

(01:30:25):

I don’t know.

(01:30:25):

That’s what she said.

(01:30:26):

Why would it be open?

(01:30:27):

I don’t know.

(01:30:28):

Is someone breaking into it?

(01:30:29):

I guess so.

(01:30:29):

What is this neighborhood?

(01:30:30):

Yeah, well, it’s just apparently you got a lot of sweat.

(01:30:35):

Podcast equipment in the back.

(01:30:40):

Anyways, finish your book and then we’ll call it good and you can close your trunk.

(01:30:44):

Yeah, what the heck?

(01:30:45):

She can close the trunk.

(01:30:47):

I swear I didn’t open it.

(01:30:48):

Yeah,

(01:30:49):

I was just going to say the fun part about writing a sequel to a book is that so

(01:30:55):

much of the first book was just trying to figure out who are these characters,

(01:30:57):

what is this place,

(01:30:58):

where the world building is like there’s so much time in that and then the second

(01:31:01):

book is like oh,

(01:31:02):

we’re already set up.

(01:31:04):

It’s just like

(01:31:05):

There’s further world building, but it’s a very different process.

(01:31:10):

I recommend, write a sequel to Loser.

(01:31:13):

My world building was easy.

(01:31:15):

It was, imagine your high school is the same as every other high school.

(01:31:18):

That’s kind of what I was going for.

(01:31:20):

I did have a lot of Grand Island anecdotes, but that’s also any small town, I think.

(01:31:26):

And on that note, buy my book.

(01:31:40):

Interesting People is produced by Chris Beaty in his basement.

(01:31:44):

A very special thanks to Ben Luters for being my first guest and my good friend.

(01:31:49):

You should definitely buy a thousand copies of his book Escape from Terikiak

(01:31:52):

because it’s fantastic.

(01:31:54):

And hey this is a brand new thing but I have a ton of fun people who have agreed to

(01:31:58):

talk to me about their interesting lives and

(01:32:00):

Please subscribe and such and do all that thing and seriously I’m really excited

(01:32:04):

about what’s to come.

(01:32:05):

It’s going to be a lot of fun.

(01:32:07):

Signing off from the greatest city on earth, Omaha, Nebraska.

December 19th, 2024

Dear Mr. Fudd,

The innards of my Royal Quiet DeLuxe typewriter have been sprayed down with a fresh coat of WD-40 and the little baby is purring like a kitten. I told my 85 year-old Uncle Bob about the WD-40, and he informed me that WD-40 stands for “water displacement formula 40.” I’m not sure how effective the first 39 formulas were, but I’m glad they kept at it.

I am eager for a resolution to your literary stunt toward Mr. Saddlemayer. I’ve never listened to KFAB, but I do have a podcast where Uncle Bob talks about growing up in Wahoo, NE. I suspect it’s similar. If you ever wish to record any dispatches to broadcast to my 108 subscribers, you have an open invitation. They’re mostly Bob’s elderly friends and the Saunders County Museum curator.

My family is nearly there with the Christmas anticipation. One of our traditions is to buy my mother anything having to do with reindeer poop. It all started with a single greeting card and jelly bean dispenser purchased by my brother many Christmases ago, and like any younger brother, I latched onto the idea and annoyed my entire family with it. The trouble is, we’ve started running out of pooping reindeer options so now any poop related gift will suffice.

Yours,

C.S. Beaty

Shortly after Haywood sent me a spiral-bound compilation of his letters to the residents of Bliss, Idaho, I sent him my own compilation of unedited essays I wrote on a typewriter. I still write a first draft of everything on one of seven functional typewriters I have in my possession, but now I go back and edit those to make them suck less. Back then I didn’t bother with that step. There was a therapeutic element to watching the typewriter keys hit the page and feeling that the message was in a permanent state. I didn’t need to edit, it just was. It was what it was, with all its grammatical errors and formatting foibles. Like a person, whatever version was birthed was the version it was going to be. It was poetic to me. And it turns out most of what I wrote on the first draft was pretty much what I intended to put down in the first place.

Now that I write more frequently, I’ve added a few steps to my writing process. I dictate all of my typewritten pages into a word doc and attempt that painstaking process of combing out all the clunky phrases and red squiggles to present myself in a more polished manner. It feels necessary, but I don’t like it. There’s a heart in the imperfection that stops beating once they’re operated on. And back in my early essays, I needed all the life I could get to keep my writing ambitions from flatlining.

For the 2023 and 2024 Christmases, I printed off all my typewritten essays from those years and bound them as family Christmas presents. Most of the feedback was a shot in the arm and led me to believe I was onto something with my writing. My raw observation and over-sharing were met with support and encouragement, but most of that feedback was from people who should probably feel obligated to give it. After all I was their son, brother, son-in-law, or friend that you stopped talking to since then. They should be on my side, even if they didn’t actually read anything until I forced a copy in their hand and scheduled a coffee date for the hour-and-a-half they were in town to attend a funeral for someone they barely knew. But I hadn’t really branched into letting strangers read what I had written, at least not until I’d mailed the 2024 version to my new pen pal.

Who not only read it, but wrote me four separate book reports on the topic.

But first, he had some updates of his own he needed to share with me.

January 22nd, 2025

Dear Mr. Beaty,

Following is the latest news from West-West Omaha for your mindfulness:

• Cleeve Happ, 66, of Dunbar, Neb., wrote the Royal Canadian Mounted Police last week to inquire about becoming an honorary member. Cleeve has firewood and rabbits for sale.

• Paisleigh Halix, 78, of Firth, Neb., has been square dancing for nigh on 70 years. The only time Paisleigh didn’t square dance with ungoverned pizzazz was when she was in the family way back in 1973, 1974 and again in 1975.

• Persephone Hulls, 74, of De Witt, Neb., randomly informs family, friends and strangers that she’s completely naked underneath her clothes. The over the fence scuttlebutt is Persephone was a real looker back in her day.

• Ennis Nichols, 78, of Ceresco, Neb., refers to German people as “Jerries” because that’s what his pop called Germans when Ennis was a whipper snapper.

• Pace Tatum, 71, of Beemer, Neb., creates make-believe traffic jams in Beemer that he phones into KTIC 840 AM. Pace has a make-believe dog named Queenie that he religiously walks in the morning and the afternoon.

• Arlie Kustda, 69, of Weston, Neb., is prone to buttonholing strangers to ask if they have any money they don’t want.

• Moses Alder, 65, of Davey, Neb., remains devilishly suspicious that a baker’s dozen is, in fact, thirteen. Moses testifies the reason for his suspicion is that his dad drummed into him to never bet another man’s game.

• Eugene Cyril, 68, of Marquette, Neb., bought his first gorilla suit at age 65. “I’m late to the party but I’m working overtime to catch up,” testified Eugene who was charged twice in 2024 was setting fire to his mailbox.

• Harry Heritage, 70, of Garland, Neb., rolls his own cigarettes and instead of using tobacco he uses catnip.

• Dick Weizner, 64, of Firth, Neb., has commissioned a chainsaw artist to carve a totem pole out of the eighteen foot high stump in his front yard. The chainsaw artist promised he would begin carving the totem pole next Tuesday after lunch.

Much obliged,

Haywood Fudd

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That’s the opening line of the query letter I wrote to send to literary agents—well it’s what my editor wrote and I slightly tweaked. Pretty good, right?

My aunt and I have been working on her biography for almost a year now. We’ve made it through the first thirty years of her life and so far, it’s really damn good.

Even before my aunt became a nomad and starred in an Oscar-winning movie, her life was captivating. She was born in 1944 in Indiana to a Christian Scientist mother who denied her any modern medical care. She suffered from chronic migraines throughout her life but wasn’t permitted painkillers as a child. Her father walked out on the family while she was an infant, leaving her with a deep longing for a parental bond that she never found. While in high school, her mother moved in with a boyfriend and Charlene stayed behind in their family home, living alone for the duration of her senior year. After high school graduation, Charlene traveled alone by bus from Indiana to South Dakota to locate her father, not telling him she was coming until she was at the bus station before her final stop. When she met her father, she was also introduced to five half-siblings who had no knowledge of her existence until that moment. Including my own father. After living in South Dakota for a few months, her stepmother chased her out and Charlene moved back to Indiana to begin college. During that time, she fell in love, dropped out of school, married a CIA agent, moved to Iran, and gave birth to her second son in a Tehran hospital. While later living in Liberia, the couple experienced marriage trouble. Charlene returned to the United States alone, got a divorce, started a commune, worked as a nanny for an abusive man with post-traumatic stress disorder, became a summer camp counselor, and moved to Colorado for college. And that just brings us to 1974. She hasn’t even become a nomad yet and certainly hasn’t starred in any movies.

This process has been quite a bit different from when I wrote my first book. The biggest difference, is I have a partner. My Aunt Swankie is acting as my research assistant. She has spent most days when she’s not on the road actively cataloging boxes of old journals, letters, and family records for salient life events and sending me relevant documents to form the narrative. Despite being her nephew, Swankie and I never interacted until 2025 when we began working together. Because I didn’t know her until we began this project, I have an objective perspective but am admittedly searching for a familial connection of my own. We communicate every day and our growing relationship has already made this project worth it.

The other difference is that I’m actually trying to find a publisher. The world of writing books is in a weird place. Amazon and other print-on-demand services have made it so you can ignore all these ivory tower New Yorkers who run the book world, and it’s very popular for all us “indie” authors to shit on those people because we’re the artists and they’re the suits. Well, after trying out the self-published route for my memoir, it turns out there may be some perks to getting someone who actually knows what they’re doing to help. So I’m trying to do that with my aunt’s story.

But here’s the thing, agents and publishers have one goal: to sell books. I mean they would love to discover the next To Kill a Mockingbird, they’re not bad people, but they have jobs. And jobs are supposed to pay you money. And to get money, people need to want to buy your books. Which means that even if you have the next To Kill a Mockingbird, it doesn’t help if no one wants to read it. And it’s really, really hard to tell people “hey trust me, you’ve never heard of this author, but he’s like really great. Easily $25 for a new hard cover great. Go ahead just buy it.” So that means, I have to try to convince these people that people want to read (and…sorry…pay for) this book about my aunt. And the easiest way to do that is with statistics.

Which means, if you want to help Swankie’s story get the attention of these book people, there are some things you can do. And I’m sorry, it’s going to sound very self-serving to me. Because they are. There’s really no way around it. Here’s my desperate cry for help:

1. Publishers want to know that an author has a track record of selling books. Which means, it would be really helpful if I sold some copies of my current book Loser*: A Survival Guide to High School Popularity. The hardcover, paperback, and ebook are all available on Amazon. And the audiobook is available on Apple. All these links are easily found on csbeaty.com. The magic number is 1,000 copies sold in the first year. I’m a little over 300 after six months in. I have a lot of work to do.

Buy Loser* Book

Link to Audio Book

2. If you don’t want to pay for my book because you’re not sure if it sucks, I don’t blame you. I don’t buy books from authors I’ve never heard of either. So what would be really awesome and FREE is if you request that your local library buys a copy. Hardcover, ebook, and audio book are all available for library purchase. I look at my own public library app every day and it makes me so happy to see when my book is checked out.

3. Another free option: after you read the book, or if you want to lie—I’m cool with lying, then put stars on things! Amazon, Goodreads, Apple podcasts, your library app. Anything! If you can click some stars for Loser* then I’ll take them! Agents and publishers love seeing lots and lots of stars.

   Put stars on Goodreads

   Put stars on Amazon

4. Subscribe to my weekly newsletter for updates on the progress on this book and other fun stuff. If you like something, then like, comment, and do that sort of thing.

   Subscribe now

All this feels silly, and I feel silly talking about it, but it’s the language the publishing industry speaks in today’s environment. If funny books about awkward, hormonal high schoolers aren’t your thing—well just do it knowing you’re helping Swankie’s book down the road.

And as a thank you, if anyone sends me an email with a mailing address to alieneagle 51@csbeaty.com, I’ll mail you a free bookplate. If you read the book, the email address will make more sense.

Contact me.

So there’s the shameless request. I feel dirty even saying it. But just to remind us all why I’m doing it, hears a portion of the query letter I wrote that will be sent to literary agents when the time is right. I really think we have something special:

Charlene Swankie was an actress in the 2020 Academy Award-winning Best Picture Nomadland. The film was adapted from a nonfiction book written by journalist Jessica Bruder who befriended my aunt. When Bruder met her, she had adopted the moniker “Swankie” in honor of the surname of her late husband. When the work was later adapted into a movie, screenwriter Chloé Zhao crafted a fictional storyline about a character named “Fern” played by Academy-Award winning actress Frances McDormand. My aunt was cast to play herself as McDormand’s co-star in a film that later won three Academy Awards and two Golden Globes. Zhao took Swankie to the Academy Award ceremony as her plus-one and thanked her by name in her Oscar acceptance speech. This story follows a rags-to-riches convention, but with an ironic ending. Despite her brush with fame, Swankie’s life hasn’t changed much. She still lives in her van and keeps to herself. And she still has many of the same wounds as she did before.

Despite being her nephew, I didn’t grow up with a relationship with Swankie. I first heard her story the same way the rest of the world did when she started appearing on lists of potential Oscar nominations. I felt guilty about this, so I didn’t reach out to her other than accepting a Facebook friend request she had initiated. But when I released my own memoir, Swankie was one of the first people to congratulate me. She said she always wanted to write her own story, so in an attempt to reconcile with my own distance from my family, I asked her if I could write it with her. And she agreed.

I was published in the Journal of Architectural Engineering and I self-published a memoir in December 2025 titled Loser*: A Survival Guide to High School Popularity. In the first five months of promoting, the memoir has sold over 300 copies and received positive reviews from Kirkus, BookLife, and Indie Reader. Kirkus Reviews gave the title a “Get It!” designation. Between my aunt and I, we have a combined social media presence of over 4,000 followers.

I believe we have a truly original and marketable concept. The movie Nomadland gripped the film community by providing a stunning glimpse into this neglected society and breaking many Hollywood conventions. But that story was just the beginning. It was a glimpse of the current state of these nomadic people, but it wasn’t an in-depth look at how generations of abandonment can shape someone’s story. This family trauma shaped Swankie, but as her nephew I am discovering how it also shaped me. The movie Nomadland has received renewed interest because of Chloé Zhao’s recent success adapting and directing the film Hamnet, which is evidenced by an uptick in the Nomadland royalties my aunt has recently received.

This book will not only appeal to fans of Nomadland: Surviving America in the Twenty-First Century by Jessica Bruder, but also: The Blind Side by Michael Lewis, Travels With Charley by John Steinbeck, Into the Wild by Jon Krakauer, and We Will Be Jaguars by Nemonte Nenquimo and Mitch Anderson. These works exposed readers to stories that are familiar yet often go untold. They showed us pictures of human resilience with in-depth analysis of character conventions that we recognize but know little about. Our book about my aunt will do the same.

I would love your help to give Swankie’s remarkable story the greatest reach possible.

Thank you.

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The former home of King Minos was carved into the side of a hill and sprawled several stories across several acres of Cretan landscape. You can say it’s labyrinthine. In fact, you’re obligated to say it’s labyrinthine since legend has it that this palace inspired the myth of the labyrinth. When you look at the setup, it’s not hard to imagine a bunch of children being fed to a half-man half-bull minotaur inside its corridors. Paige and I waited at the top of the entrance. We were fourth in line, our anticipation growing as we waited to enter this historic maze.

At least until a small Greek man in a funny hat pulled away from the ticket counter to make an announcement.

“EXCUSE ME LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, THE MONUMEMT IS NOW CLOSED FOR THE REST OF THE DAY DUE TO THE WIND. IT IS TOO DANGEROUS TO ALLOW MORE PEOPLE TO ENTER THE RUIN. PLEASE COME BACK TOMORROW.”

No, no, no, no, no. There was no “come back tomorrow” for us. Tomorrow we would be on a plane to Athens. If we wanted to get lost in a castle allegedly built to hide the offspring of a queen who hid in a wooden cow suit so she could be fucked by a white bull that her husband was supposed to sacrifice to the god Poseidon, we had to do it now.

We took stock of the scene. Our fellow linemates who were also denied entry were thick in their protest. We thought about playing the “we’re on our honeymoon and this is the only thing we came to Crete to see and we fly out tomorrow” card, but at this point the man with the funny hat was giving the same rebuttal without listening to further arguments. The decision was made. The people we watched purchase tickets and enter the ruins ahead of us would be the last admitted for the day. If they were given a concussion from flying debris, so be it, but the rest of us would not be given the opportunity. Our tourism dollars and Greece’s bankrupt economy be damned.

I started to panic. I pulled away from the crowd to take stock of the situation. I ventured around the edge of the entrance, looking for some clue to gain admittance while the attendant with the funny hat was distracted by the throngs of visitors detailing how he had just ruined their day. There was a trickle of tourists walking out of a path off to the side. I gestured to Paige, and my bride and I slowly eased closer to the source. We moved stealthily, as to not alert anyone of our covert aims to solve this riddle of entering Knossos during monsoon season. We realized we had found the exit of the ruins, and it was completely unsupervised.

I looked my wife in the eyes, seeing if she was following the same clues as I to solve how we would get inside. She responded with a single word.

“Yup.”

After double checking that the only visible employee was still occupied with mutinous tourists declaring their outrage over the injustice they had been given, Paige and I darted through the back gate. Our goal was to quickly embed ourselves deep enough into the ruins to appear we had always been there. It wasn’t difficult to do. Once we had made entry, the zigs of walkways and zags of corridors disguised any discernible path and made it simple to appear in the middle of a tour that had begun before the hurricane winds forced the closure of the ruin.

We were inside the labyrinth. Now we just had to figure out where we were supposed to go.

We paused to consider our surroundings. We were far from the only ones inside the ruins, but judging from my wife’s hair standing on end, we were certain the staff would soon be in the process of shutting down the attraction. I removed my hat and stuffed it into my back pocket so it wouldn’t blow off, allowing the gusts to blast my bangs into a cow lick. We spotted the man with the funny hat. He was slowly plodding down from his post at the entrance, having sealed it from additional money paying customers, and was starting the process of hurrying up the remaining guests as quickly as possible to the exit. Our afternoon had become a game of Pac-Man.

As Paige inspected a placard with a map, I bent down to pick up a weird seed pod that had blown off a tree and a rock that had chipped off from a wall. I inspected them closely and placed my treasures in my pocket. Satisfied with her research, Paige told me to follow her, but we only took a few steps before I heard a scratchy voice behind me shouting in Greek. I ignored it. The yelling increased. As I looked around, I knew there was no one else these angry Greek commands could be meant for. Shit. It got us.

Wincing from the wind blowing in my face, I turned to see a Greek woman. I mentally prepared to be escorted out of the ruins and charged with trespassing. I decided we could plead ignorance and avoid getting in trouble for breaking and entering, but for the second time in a five-minute span I felt my dreams of experiencing the stomping grounds of the Minotaur vanishing.

She was furious, but I noticed that her pulsing Greek cursing was accentuated with aggressive hand gestures. She kept repeating the same phrase and pointing to the ground. She wasn’t acting like she wanted us to follow her, she just stayed in place, thrusting her index finger downward and spitting venom. Still unsure of what was happening, I got an idea. I slipped my hand into my pocket and dramatically removed the rock, placing it on the ground like an armed robber surrendering his firearm to a police officer with his gun drawn. As soon as the rock was back in the dirt, the angry Greek woman muttered something, turned her back, and walked toward the exit without indicating we were supposed to follow.

I looked at Paige, shrugged, and turned the corner. Once I felt safely out of sight of any pursuers, I found two new rocks and put them in my pocket.

Page and I pushed further in. We found the dolphin room that contained the shittiest looking dolphin pictures I’ve seen in a while, and the big painted columns next to a painting of kids jumping over a bull that shows up in all the tourism photos. You can only see the bull’s ass—the top half has been lost to history from grave robbers or assaults from the wind hurtling seed pods at it for a millennium. We followed a rope-railing to a lower section, but as we turned on to the stairwell our path was blocked by a sterned faced Greek man in a funny hat.

Fuck. I guess this was it.

We slowed, attempting to blend with the other nearby tourists who have been granted legal access and actually paid for a ticket. But it was too late. The Greek man in the funny hat had me.

“I’m sorry sir. But this part is unsafe because of the wind, I cannot allow you to go down these stairs. Please continue down the other path.”

I assured him that was no problem. After all, safety first.

We found an English-speaking tour group and used them as a disguise. The strength in numbers made it more difficult to be split off and eliminated by the museum staff. We kept within earshot of the tour leader—and even learned few fun facts about some peacock-looking things etched into the walls. As we left one of the bathhouses, I asked Paige what we had left to see. She flipped through a guidebook in her backpack with less urgency than before. We were getting lazy. And we paid the price. The man with the funny hat found us.

“I’m sorry sir. But the palace is too dangerous because of the wind. We are asking everyone to leave for your own safety. Would you please follow me to the nearest exit?”

We obeyed. He had us. Our time in the labyrinth was now over.

“I am so sorry, can we give you a free ticket to come back tomorrow?”

I stuck my hand in my pocket and fingered the rocks and seed pod—my trophies from a successful assault on the Minoan palace.

“No thanks, I think we saw everything. Besides, tomorrow we’re leaving Crete.”

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So there once was this guy named King Minos who was gifted a white bull from Poseidon, the god of the ocean, and man, this white bull was awesome. Like really, really fucking great. So great that instead of sacrificing this white bull to Poseidon like he was supposed to, King Minos thought, “why would I want a perfectly good white bull to be slaughtered, let’s use one of my shitty bulls instead, Poseidon probably doesn’t even know what a good bull looks like. He’ll never know.” So that’s what he did.

But guess what, Poseidon noticed. And he was really fucking pissed.

Whereas the Judeo-Christian God would just make you wallow in your guilt and shame, or send plagues of locusts and murder your first born child—Poseidon was a bit more cunning. He knew he had to get King Minos back for thinking he was too stupid to notice that the dead bull thrown into the ocean wasn’t the kickass white one he really wanted. I mean, he was really counting on that thing being slaughtered for his pleasure. But Poseidon was a crafty son-of-a-bitch. He had a plan. King Minos was about to get soooo fucked.

That white bull was still chilling in whatever pen King Minos kept his best bulls, and every so often the queen would go down and admire this really, really awesome white bull. So Poseidon did what any pissed off god-of-the-ocean would do: he made the queen—the wife of King Minos—fall in love with that white bull.

And we’re not just saying she admired the bull. We’re talking insatiable physical lust for this beast. Like the sight of this bull would make her swoon. She stayed up late at night having nasty thoughts about all the things she wanted this white bull to do to her.

But the problem was, this bull just wasn’t feeling the same way about her. He was a bull after all, not some weird pervert.

But the queen was determined, and just as crafty as the angry god-of-the-ocean who put an interspecies love-spell on her.

If you remember the Trojan horse, the Greeks have one foolproof way of getting what they want: they build a wooden animal and sneak inside it. It’s the top play in their playbook.

The queen went to a guy named Daedalus who was awesome at building stuff—and imprisoned on Crete for being kind of a dick— and asked him to make her a really, really life-like cow. But not just any cow, this one had to be hollow inside so she could sneak inside it while—you guessed it—the white bull fucked her.

And this dude built it.

Now artists and historians differ on the exact design of this wooden cow sex-doll, but at a minimum it had a butt-flap or something. I also don’t know how long it took to build, but suffice to say to do the job properly it probably takes at least enough time for the average person to think, “welllll… maybe not. Maybe I don’t want to have sex with a white bull.”

But nope, no second thoughts here. No cold feet. By the time Daedalus was done with the heifer sex-suit, the Queen was still in heat.

And the cow suit worked great.

Worked so well in fact, that the Queen became pregnant.

Pregnant with a half-man, half-bull that you may affectionately know as: The Minotaur.

And Poseidon just laughed his ass off.

King Minos, on the other hand, was understandably a bit embarrassed by the whole thing. I’m not sure if his wife ever came clean, but I’m pretty sure that once the kid was born he knew he probably wasn’t the father.

To hide his shame, he made Daedalus build a crazy-ass maze and forced his mutant stepson to live in it. It was the most obvious option he had. And luckily, Minos had another, top-half and bottom-half, human son. But then the Athenians killed him. Holy shit King Minos was pissed about this. He waged war on the Athenians, kicked their asses, and made the losers participate in a fucked-up, Hunger Games-style human sacrifice game. Each year seven boys and seven girls were forced into the labyrinth so his weird-ass stepson could chase them and eat them.

And things were finally going great for the King. At least until a dude named Theseus pulled a Katniss Everdeen and volunteered for tribute to ruin his weird game.

The problem this time was that King Minos’s daughter had the hots for Theseus, which is pretty inconvenient but way less weird than the time her mom made a wooden cow-suit to get banged by a white bull. I’m also getting the feeling that King Minos wasn’t much of a family man. The Princess gave Theseus a ball of thread, which she got from our homeboy Daedalus, which was the least weird thing he ever did for the royal family, and Theseus tied one end of the string to a doorpost. He hid his sword (I guess Minos’s henchman never thought of checking for swords), got some clues from the Princess on navigating the labyrinth, and found a sleeping minotaur. He cut off the poor monster’s head, found the other kids stuck in the maze, and followed the thread out the exit. He took the Princess and sailed away from the island of Crete—only to promptly dump the Princess once he got back home.

But don’t worry about her, she rebounded by hooking up with half-man, half-god Dionysus.

●●●

As captivating as this love story is, this tale wasn’t the reason I wanted to go to Crete for our honeymoon. It was because Crete was in a Bible verse. I was really into Bible verses when I got married. Granted, it wasn’t like, a famous Bible verse—not like the ones we used to justify our trip to the Areopagus or the ancient city of Corinth—but it was still in there and we had a week’s itinerary to fill while in Greece.

OK, not super exciting, but not all Bible verses can be winners.

There’s also one in Titus that said:

Which seems a little harsh. Sure, they make cow-suits to get fucked by cattle and sacrifice children to mutant bull-monsters, but no one ever said they were “lazy.”

Thoroughly intrigued, my new bride and I hired a Greek travel agent named Dora and decided to find out for ourselves.

●●●

Crete is an island off the southern tip of Greece, and though it’s been featured in a Bible verse, it’s typically not the Greek island you go to on your honeymoon. My wife wanted to go to those islands, but once I started throwing out Bible verses she knew she was going to have a tough time winning the argument. We compromised and agreed to do nothing that she wanted to do, and in exchange, maybe we’d go back for our ten-year anniversary. Luckily, our actual wedding had enough drama to distract her from caring too much about our honeymoon itinerary.

After eating a gyro with a hamburger patty at the airport McDonald’s, we picked up a diesel-powered, manual transmission, Peugeot from the Chania rental-car stand. We weren’t sure why Dora had booked a hotel in the city of Chania since the main attraction in Crete was a several hour drive, but she insisted and told us we would need need this rental car. We didn’t ask a lot of questions, she seemed to know the riddle of Cretan vacations. We checked into our shockingly swanky honeymoon suite and got dinner at a restaurant inside a decommissioned Turkish bathhouse. They just served food now instead of sweaty, naked men, but we had a functional Turkish steam run in our honeymoon suite to make up for any inconvenience this presented. Upon return, we thanked the concierge for the excellent dinner recommendation and asked for advice for when to leave for the city of Heraklion the next morning.

Heraklion is the capital of Crete and the only reason we went there other than Bible verses. Around the year 1900 AD, an archaeologist named Arthur Evans got super into the labyrinth myth and started looking for it. Like most Greek mythology, the weird stuff blended with the historical record like a Gabriel Garcia Marquez novel, and this Arthur Evans dude was convinced the labyrinth was real. And after digging around in a hill in northern Crete, I guess he was right. Sort of.

He didn’t find a maze that housed a half-man, half-bull monstrosity who feasted on the prepubescent bodies his dad fed him for fun, but Evans did find an insanely elaborate palace that had a bunch of confusing hallways and a big ass mural of kids jumping over a bull. But it was like a full-bull, without any half-man parts.

History said, “close enough” and now the bulk of Crete’s tourism dollars come from tours of this “Palace of Knossos” and the purchase of replica pottery with pictures of kids jumping over a bull. We had already bought a pot at a gift shop, now we just needed to see this temple. But we needed some help navigating there from the concierge.

“Don’t go tomorrow, it’s too crowded. Go the next day.”

Well, I guess he knows more than we do. Instead we made plans to visit a beach resort so my wife could do something other than just the things I wanted to do.

●●●

We had declined the €17.00 per day insurance on the diesel-powered Peugeot, and after learning the state of the Cretan highway system, we second guessed the decision. You still drove on the same side of the road and all that, but the concept of highway medians or two-lane traffic could not have been more foreign to the Cretans. There were no lanes, just a long patch of unmarked asphalt. But despite this lack of painted road markers, they managed to cram as many rows of cars, side-by-side, heading in both directions of traffic, as the width of whatever patch of asphalt you were on could manage. And then a couple more for good measure. If you needed to pass the car in front of you, there was no point in waiting for oncoming traffic to be clear. It would never be clear. Instead, you held your breath and punched the gas—counting on any potential collisions to be avoided by a last minute swing into the gravel shoulder by either you or the bat-out-of-hell screaming toward you. You got really good at eyeballing just how wide a diesel-powered Peugeot is. It turns out you don’t need as much room as you think. And all that was before factoring in the wind, road debris, and winding mountain pathways with blind corners.

But after a while, I got comfortable enough to turn on the radio. The seat mate on the domestic flight from Athens to Chania insisted that we listen to the local Cretan music. He said it was unique from any other region of the country and we were in for a treat. He couldn’t give much for explanation, but the station we found with the clearest reception between mountain ranges was playing acoustic cover of Michael Jackson’s Billie Jean. The rendition had very deliberate enunciations and a spoken word, thick-Greek-accent style of singing. They played the song multiple times during our ride. I’m not sure if this was the particular song our single-serving travel companion had in mind, but it’s the only sampling I needed.

He was right, I had never heard anything like it.

●●●

The wind and the beach of Elafonisi was biblical. And since this exact wind was mentioned in one of the Bible verses I read while planning this trip, I’m using that phrase correctly for the first time in my life. It was also the offseason for this allegedly bustling beach property. There was no one else on the beach to block the wind from pelting exposed cheeks with grains of sand. Whatever beach chairs available for rent had been chained together and vacated, any public outhouses sealed and put into hibernation. It was dangerous to remove your sunglasses for fear of sand grains tearing a pinhole gash in your cornea, but the beach itself looked pretty through the UV-tinting.

We brought a couple of beach towels. We weren’t planning on swimming, but my bride was hoping to do some reading while I paraded the beachside looking for something to do. We decided to give it a go, but as we unfolded the beach towel the wind caught it and blew it as horizontal as Donald Trump’s comb over. Paige tried to make the best of it while I scanned the sand at my feet for sea glass, but as the Apostle Paul himself had learned during his time on Crete, the weather just wasn’t willing to cooperate. The Lord had other plans. And I really had to take a shit.

●●●

We already knew the status of the sealed off porta-potties, but we spotted a sprawling beachside restaurant near where we parked. We yanked on the door. Closed for the season. There wasn’t a single available toilet on the entire beach. I guess people weren’t supposed to come here when it’s terrible out.

We mounted our diesel-powered Peugeot and headed back into town. We didn’t find anything that resembling a public restaurant or public toilet, but there was a house with some tables in the front yard and a vinyl sign advertising beer specials. It felt promising. And there were a bunch of feral cats hanging around. The feral cats probably knew the best spots to eat in Elafonisi.

As we parked and greeted the woman who seemed to be in charge using the only Greek we knew, I immediately inquired about a toilet while Paige pet a stray cat. I was told the riddle to the bathroom, going around the house and through a back alleyway, before discovering the most disgusting place I had pooped thus far in Europe. Having slain my foe, I followed the stray cats to where my wife was seated and ordered a beer and something made of pork. The pork arrived lightly seared and pink in the middle. We left the raw meat for the cats, settled our tab, and braced for another journey through the Cretan highway system before rewarding ourselves with the steam bath in our honeymoon suite.

Our assault on the labyrinth would have to wait until tomorrow.

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My wife and I have this inside joke about how my birthday is always terrible. Despite her best efforts, something seems to inevitably go wrong (I’m looking at you COVID). It was sort-of-funny for a while, but last year it stopped being funny. My 35th birthday was solid, but I was just over the humor of things not going well on the day that was supposed to be my day. Adults aren’t supposed to like their birthdays. We’re supposed to shrug it off and say, “oh thanks” when someone wishes you a “Happy Birthday.” We like to pretend that we are so humble and not in the least self-absorbed—and we show this by pretending we don’t care about the day every one else is supposed to care about us. Maybe it’s a defense mechanism, like the way my wife hates Teacher Appreciation week because she always ends up feeling less than appreciated. If we pretend we don’t care, we don’t get disappointed when other people care less than we think they should. But we do care. Only sociopaths don’t care.

My family did a great job this year. They do a great job every year. And nothing seemed to go wrong. And when my brother made an AI emo song with the help of my nephew and niece, I felt seen. It’s great to have others see you. Especially when the thing they see is a jackalope that plays drums and likes hockey.

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They asked me to record a greeting to their group, which I did:

The chat bot thought this video was great. But it also wanted a “cinematic book trailer” and a “landing page.” “That’s oddly specific,” I thought, but not wanting to disappoint my new AI chatbot fan, I sent the AI chatbot a link to my website and tried recording a trailer. And the AI chatbot hated it. And the AI chatbot was convinced all of East London would hate it. No, no, no, this will never do. BUT GOOD NEWS! WE KNOW HOW TO MAKE THESE FOR YOU!

I told the AI chatbot no, I would not like their AI chatbot friends to make me a “cinematic trailer” and “landing page” for my book for a small fee. As a matter of fact, I was tired of talking to this AI chatbot altogether. The AI chatbot’s exacting standards had frankly soured me on the entire East London book club.

Besides, I had an email from a book club in Copenhagen that needed my attention, they were really excited to feature my book!

LET’S DO THIS DENMARK!

I kind of liked the video trailer though, so I thought I would share. Maybe it’ll make its way to East London one day.

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We did it.

We did 100 of something.

Well, I did.

But you noticed, and that counts for something.

But probably not for 100 of something.

Since I started this dumb newsletter over two years ago, we’ve had over 20,900 views and generated $0 of income. Which was exactly what I budgeted. Man, it’s great when something goes according to plan.

Here’s the highlight reel:

See you for next week for post 101.

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December 12th, 2024

Dear Mr. Beaty,

Your dispatch and the delightful dispatches your children sent to Santa Claus warmed the heart of the aging King of the Literary Daredevils.

Congratulations on your new typewriter! For your whatnot: some years ago I read that Ernest Hemingway banged away on his typewriter while standing up. You may find this scrap of information arresting and elect to follow Hemingway’s lead (or not). Some additional chapter and verse on typewriters: gangsters from the 1930s referred to Thompson submachine guns as “Chicago typewriters.” I concluded my first book “The Kansas City Massacre, Volume II, The Digital Edition” with that delicious scrap of evidence.

My current world-record literary stunt is sending Mr. Gary Sadlemyer (the morning protagonist on KFAB1110 AM) a dispatch every Monday and Friday with ungovernable news from West-West Omaha. Tomorrow (Dec 13), dispatch #43 will be mailed. Two of my West-West Omaha dispatches are attached for your bulging consideration.

Merry Christmas & Much Obliged,

Haywood Fudd

My kids must have trusted me that their Christmas lists were successfully posted to Saint Nick since they never challenged me on the topic, but for good measure, additional lists of demands were penned and placed beneath our synthetic Christmas tree. I tried finding a copy of The Kansas City Massacre, Volume II, The Digital Edition online, but without success. I had a feeling that comment was a gag, but then again, what if it wasn’t? What if this magical work about mobsters and machine guns in the central plains really was out there somewhere? Just waiting for me to find it, be educated on Midwestern crime syndicates, and learn fun facts about fully automatic weapons, as told by a man whose only aim is to bring happiness to those he crosses paths with? That, is something I want to believe in.

And even though the only result the Google search on the topic yielded was a 1975 made-for-TV movie that Fudd undoubtedly had seen, I still choose to believe in this digital sequel, living in a far off-realm of the Internet, that seems attainable yet so distant.

Tis the season to believe after all. Or at least it was when I got this letter.

The letters to KFAB public radio host Gary Saddlemyer were different. I had no doubt Fudd actually wrote those, and sent them, twice a week, just as he said he did. He didn’t need to send me proof, but he did. Twice. Which according to his note, were the 42nd and 43rd letters he had sent Mr. Saddlemyer. I never listened to KFAB and never heard of this morning-talk-show-host, but another Google search suggested that he never made use of Fudd’s news from West-West Omaha. If you place “gary saddlemyer haywood fudd” together in a search engine, the query only retrieves a link to my own website—at least those are the only results that Google thinks I want to see.

But Fudd seemed undeterred by this lack of acclaim or recognition. He kept at it, up until Saddlemyer announced his own retirement after a fifty-year career on morning radio. Fudd wrote him until August 4th, 2025. Another 58 letters in all after the two that he had sent me. Making exactly 100 total.

I know this because in 2025, he sent a spiral-bound compilation of them all as my Christmas present.

And as it turns out, Gary Saddlemyer wasn’t the only public figure Fudd had been writing twice a week, but more on that later.

Exactly 100 letters more on that later.

December 9th, 2024

Dear Mr. Saddlemyer,

The latest news from West-West Omaha:

• Nero Haberkorn, 65, of Avoca, Neb., testifies the first things he’s going to ask the supreme architect is why he allowed the NCAA to pass the name, image, and likeness hooey that’s going to massacre any hope of the Huskers to ever win the national championship.

• Henrietta Cordell, 77, of Ulysses, Neb., wears an apron everywhere including to Sunday school, the five-and-dime, and the funeral parlor.

• Klaus Forrester, 72, who roosts near Plum Creek off of County Road 23, which is a country mile north of Bee, Neb., trumpets he wouldn’t live in a big city for all the gold in Fort Knox but that he’d give his eyeteeth for an all-you-can-eat Chinese buffet near his spread.

• Jack Moon, 85, of David, Neb., smells old.

Much obliged,

Haywood Fudd

December 13th, 2024

Dear Mr. Saddlemyer,

The latest news from West-West Omaha:

• Vernon Cripple, 61, of Staplehurst, Neb., is back to saving money to buy a used tank. “Owning a tank is my sole obsession. I can’t get owning a tank out of my system,” testified Vernon who certifies quality used tanks are divine investments. Vernon previously saved for a used tank in 2014, 2016, 2017, and 2021.

• Mayme Dempsey, 81, of a Abie, Neb., says Omaha should give some strapping consideration to changing its name to Omaha-ha for what she certifies are “prima facie” reasons. Mayme remains a whale of a devotee of Johnny Paycheck who achieved country music repute with his ditties “Take This Job and Shove It” and “I’m the Only Hell (Mama Ever Raised).”

• Justus Crawl, 55, of Dorchester, Neb., says it’s not the brutal winters that ruffle his tail feathers, but the number of drivers he encounters on the roads who drive as though they couldn’t hammer a railroad spike into a snowdrift.

• Soothsayer Poe Dansk, 68, of Prague, and Neb., is predicting the world is going out of business next Tuesday between 3:00 and 4:00 PM, but no later than 5:20 PM CST.

• Celeste “Lady Godiva” Feemer, 49, lives outside of Pickrell, Neb., on SW 2nd Road. Lady Godiva’s chock full of pizzazz, oomph, and all that jazz. On Flag Day last year, she blasted through Pickrell on her Harley and the only thing she was wearing was vintage motorcycle goggles.

Much obliged,

Haywood Fudd

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It’s not that I have strong reservations about feeling stupid, I’m a bit used to it, but I’d rather not if I had the option. Which means that in an attempt to sell a book, and thus not feel stupid, you start looking for opportunities. You look at your friends and think, “maybe him?” And you realize that not only does your friend not want to buy your book, he doesn’t want to read your book, because he doesn’t want to read any books, because your friend doesn’t even like books. And you start doubting who your friends really are because in this moment you see how little you have in common with any of them. And they don’t even want to give you a sympathy book purchase.

But they will, if you insist. Which makes you feel really stupid.

And you’re back to where you began and you still have boxes of books in your basement.

Most of my friends and family were enthusiastically supportive of my book, but a handful acted as though I recruited them to join a multi-level marketing scheme. When a prominent “bookstagrammer” I knew didn’t reply to my message about using some free copies for one of her bookstagrammer giveaways, I felt like I had just been turned down as her homecoming date. And then there was the podcaster I knew who was happy to give me advice, but fell just short of actually offering any sort of public endorsement to all of his podcaster friends.

It’s just a really weird thing to try to sell a book.

Since the internet had yet to do all the work for me, I decided to start buying lottery tickets. I bought a VIP package to meet the emo band Emery prior to their Omaha show. When the date came, I gave the lead singer five copies of my book for their six band members. I had miscounted, but one of the guys barely does shit in the band anyways, so he doesn’t need one. My angle was to take advantage of their $500 “LET EMERY WRITE YOU A SONG” promotion, and the lead singer guy was really nice about: taking the stack of five books, saying he would take my $500, saying he would indeed write me a song, and would definitely be looking for my e-mail later on the subject matter. I sent them that e-mail, and the $500, and an excited message with lots of exclamation points. In return, I received a reply from one of the girlfriends saying the members of the band—a band I idolized, listened to fervently, loved interacting in person with—got together and decided they didn’t want to write a song about my book. The guy in the band who doesn’t really play an instrument must have been pissed I didn’t bring a copy for him.

I got my $500 refunded, along with the knowledge that the members of one of my favorite bands talked about me behind my back.

They later re-did their website and clarified that the whole “LET EMERY WRITE YOU A SONG” thing was really meant for dudes with jobs to buy as a gift for their emo girlfriend. I guess that makes sense. But it doesn’t help me sell any books.

Despite the fact that Emery now had five copies of Loser*: A Survival Guide to High School Popularity in their possession, I had no proof of it. And now that I couldn’t even pay them to write a song to promote my book like their website said I could, I decided I needed to buy a different lottery ticket.

When “Weird Al” Yankovic and Penn & Teller had meet and greets of their own, I brought copies to give them, and posed for a selfie with the book before forcing them into their hands. They were confused, but nice about it. I repeated the process with Todd Packer and Ryan Howard from The Office, but Chevy Chase never lifted a single appendage the entire time fans of Christmas
Vacation posed for photos with him after a festive movie screening. I was convinced they had replaced the real Chevy Chase with a wax figure glued to a bar stool until my wife said, “thanks for coming to Omaha,” and the animatronic replica of the former SNL Weekend Update host replied with, “of course.”

https://www.csbeaty.com/loser

So Chevy didn’t get a copy of my book and he certainly didn’t tell his agent about me. But I did get a selfie with him. And a Chevy Chase trading card handed out by a member of his entourage.

●●●

It’s not that I expected any of these celebrities to make me famous, but I mean, they could if they wanted to, right? And how would they know if they wanted to unless they had a copy of my book? David Sedaris mentioned on his Masterclass that whenever someone tells him they want to be a writer, he invites them to open for him on tour before one of his readings. So I mean, it could happen, right?

Right?

I decided to find out. I gave David Sedaris a copy of my book when he did a pre-show signing in Des Moines, Iowa and I made it very clear that I was the person who wrote it.

Wrong.

Sedaris was super nice though. We talked about a plastic fetus he received the night before from a pro-life advocate, and I wrote an entire essay about the fun I had that evening at his show. And maybe, you know, he just didn’t think about it? Maybe he regretted not inviting me onto the stage once he realized he didn’t have an opener for his Des Moines tour date? Maybe he was kicking himself for the lost opportunity?

So once the show was over, I went through the book signing line again.

And Sedaris recognized me.

And he was super nice, again, even apologetic that I had to go through the long wait a second time.

And he gave me a very nice signature and inscription to my children.

And sent me on my way back to Omaha, Nebraska.

Well shit.

But it’s hard to blame the guy. His bedside manner with each autograph seeker was truly commendable but he was also eating a steak and potato dinner during the post-show signing and likely not auditioning fans to be his opening act. There was probably some protocol or process for that, but hell if I knew what that was. I didn’t even know the process for getting a woman I had known for sixteen years to give away free copies of my book on her Instagram page.

I started looking for clues.

●●●

Having lived my entire life in a State that is rarely talked about, any mention of where I’m from, no matter how frivolous, jumps out from the page and latches onto my face like those things from the movie Alien. Having recently met Sedaris, I started reading his book Calypso, and once I made it a page-and-a-half into the title essay, I had an alien latched onto my face—pumping alien eggs into my stomach cavity that resembled civic pride and ideas about this mysterious world of becoming an author who sells books and doesn’t feel stupid.

Omaha. There it was. I live in Omaha. My dreams felt closer to home as I discovered this loose thread to tug on.

The essay naturally goes on to describe Sedaris getting a fatty tumor cut out of him by an autograph seeker who then mailed the biological waste to his beach home so he could use it to feed a snapping turtle. The essay’s title “Calypso” is taken from a passing reference to someone giving your cat a secret name behind your back. But Sedaris wasn’t quite through with Janet.

I googled “janet wood interpretation society” and came up with what appeared to be a reputable e-mail address. So I used it. I asked her if we could meet up somewhere in Omaha so she could sign my copy of Sedaris’s Calypso. It felt particularly appropriate since the book cover for this volume of essays was a plank of wood with a smiley face.

Now this request may seem a little bold, but honestly, I send emails like this weekly and anticipate most of them never to receive a reply. I’ve sent celebrity ethics professor Michael Sandel a copy of a college paper I wrote about one of his books and an essay about locker room nudity to stand-up comedian Demetri Martin. I’ve asked Paul Scheer how to locate a DVD copy of season 2 of his sketch comedy troupe with Aziz Ansari Human Giant and asked ex-Christian singer Derek Webb to play at a concert in my basement. Basically if someone I vaguely admire has an accessible e-mail posted somewhere on the Internet, I look for an excuse to send them a message. The majority never reply, and honestly they probably shouldn’t, but as a result of this low hit-rate, you can imagine my thrill when I received the following message fourteen hours later in my inbox:

And that, my friend, was the most exciting thing to happen since the time Jason “Wee Man” Acuña from Jackass mailed me an autographed hockey puck, baseball card, thank-you note, and an assortment of skateboard stickers.

Sensing an opening, I tried to keep the communication going. I really didn’t have an angle. Now that I wouldn’t be getting her signature next to the doodle of a naked woman Sedaris had hand drawn for Devon on the inside cover of one of my three copies of Calypso, all I wanted was to learn as much as I could about this fascinating woman. I asked about her son mentioned in the essay and she said that he was a writer. She sent me a link to a humorous essay he wrote about Papal election procedures. As it turns out, Janet’s son was Sedaris’s opening act the last time he did a reading in Omaha and Jimmy also joined him on a couple of recent tour stops.

So I guess the trick to getting invited to open for Sedaris is to have a mother who has been featured in one of his essays and has also supplied him with a framed sheet of plywood for his beach house.

This might be tricky.

Particularly since my mother has no idea who David Sedaris is and tends to avoid reading anything with curse words in it unless it’s something I wrote. She feels obligated to read those.

She also has a slightly different background than Janet:

But even with the advantage of going to dinner parties with the world’s-greatest living humorist, Janet was empathetic to the struggle of finding your creative voice in a crowded room.

●●●

I had my Omaha book release and celebrated Christmas Day from an urgent care waiting room with other carriers of the influenza-A virus. Once the New Year had arrived, I convinced my family to discard the $50 ping-pong table we had bought from Facebook marketplace so I could turn that cavernous waste of basement floor space into a library and writing study. I paid a buddy to install a fake copper ceiling and stretched the rest of my construction budget by building bookshelves out of hastily stained 2 x 4s. It really did look nice in the end, and the natural wood grain of my new library added a neat character and aesthetic. I hung a few pictures of my favorite authors, but my shelf of Sedaris books felt a bit empty.

I sent my new friend a message to help solve that:

One day later, she replied to my text:

Three weeks later, a package arrived.

If I look closely, I can see the Chihuahua. Or the raccoon. Or whatever I want it to be.

Or, if you look at it just right and for long enough—it could be a snapping turtle who just finished eating the tumor of a best-selling author, looking around for more before disappearing, like the ingrate that he is, back into his foul and riled depths.

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December 9^th, 2024

Dear Mr. Fudd,

If you notice a change in font from previous correspondences, it is due to the use of my Christmas present from my octogenarian distant relative who stumbled upon a beautiful Royal typewriter in pristine condition at a garage sale. At least that’s the story he gave me.

Congratulations on the grandchild and the successful literary assault on the good people of Bliss, Idaho. I trust both events have resulted in unparalleled merry-making by all involved. I enjoyed your Christmas letter, but found the decapitated bull an all too familiar sight. My wife and I once watched the murder of 6 consecutive bulls at the conclusion of the festival of San Fermin in Pamplona, Spain. My favorite bull was named Gabriela, and the feminine name attributed to him seemed to have really upset the poor fellow. Being murdered didn’t help the situation. When the matador went for the kill shot with his sword, Gabriela thrust herself backward, snapped the sword in half, and charged his assailant. It didn’t end well for either.

I’ve included my children’s letters to Santa since I seem to have misplaced Mr. Kringle’s address and I have some promises to keep regarding posting their annual list of demands. My middle child didn’t bother to write one. She’s kind of like that.

In the name of merriment,

C.S. Beaty

•••

Each time I wrote to Haywood, I added a little flair of my own. I inherited my dad’s stamp collection, which he kept for roughly three years during the mid-90s before losing interest in collecting postage. Not having any other use for the 32 to 34 cent Looney Tunes stamps, I started using them to send my wife postcards. I tried to match the postcard’s theme or location with an appropriate stamp from my dad’s collection, but I was never sure what to do with all the World War II or prominent physicist stamps my dad had assembled. Until I started writing frequent letters to Haywood Fudd.

I found a hipster-stationary store and bought a variety of odd-sized and odd-colored hipster envelopes, but that still felt a bit underwhelming for the treatment Fudd deserved. So, I bought a hot wax seal with the letter “B,” and then a hot wax seal of a bat, and then had a custom hot wax seal of a jackalope made. We were getting there.

But the real joy came from the bonus added content I shoved in each envelope. This same hipster-stationary shop sold collectible Barbie cards from the 1980s, so I selected a few of my favorites to send to Haywood.

Which then led to me keeping every intriguing scrap of paper or other flat item that I could send in a letter. When my mom bought me a very Christian bookmark with some coffee/Bible verse pun, I sent it to Haywood. When I ordered a few jars of root beer-flavored mustard and they came with a “Mustard Gift Guide” from the “Mustard Hall of Fame,” I also mailed that to Haywood. And when I sent Haywood five identical stickers of the University of Nebraska-Omaha mascot Durango the bull, Fudd sent me back a bull sticker with his head chopped off. He did it very carefully.

Early on, Fudd sent me two dollars in each of his letters, but once he learned of my devotion to this correspondence, he scaled back his budget. But on occasion he still burned holes in the paper with an open flame.

When I started regularly writing, I compiled my typewritten unedited essays into a booklet for my family—these were the books I was having made when Mike the Printer first introduced me to Fudd. So when I repeated the task in 2024, I sent a volume to my new pen pal. And in return, Haywood sent me a compilation of his own complete collection of letters to the residents of Bliss, Idaho—gift wrapped and with a Christmas card.

•••

•••

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In my job interview, Guenther asked if I golfed. I told him no. He told me that wouldn’t be a problem—he didn’t golf either—but if I ever wanted to learn, well, it would probably be a good idea. He even said he would have the company pay for golf lessons. During my first week on the job, the US Senior Open was being played at the Omaha Country Club for the first time ever, and my new office excitedly purchased a set of four tickets to the event. As a new member of the sales team, I was granted the opportunity to help fill these tickets, if only I had any idea what one was supposed to do at a golf event that wasn’t even for the normal professional golfers. My co-worker Al had to explain it to me.

“So this is the US Open?”

“No, the Senior Open.”

“What’s the difference?”

“This is for the Senior PGA.”

“The what?”

“The Senior PGA, it’s the older golfers who aren’t in the regular PGA. Well a few of them play in both.”

“You mean like Phil Mickelson?”

“No, no. Like Bernhard Langer.”

“Who?”

“Freddy Couples?”

“Who?”

“God Dammitt. Tom Watson? You ever heard of Tom Fucking Watson?”

“Ummmm…No?”

Al had some serious work to do with me.

●●●

I made the mistake of telling my mom I was trying to get into golf, who—having never learned any of my true interests—latched onto this new pursuit with vigor when it came time to buy me any and all Christmas presents. When I turned 24, my mom instructed Eileen’s Colossal Cookies to make me a golf-themed birthday cookie and when they returned from South Carolina, I was given screen-printed golf balls with the logo of each of the tourist traps my parents had visited. My mom naturally assumed I would be collecting these now. My Christmas present was a cheap range finder, which my mom admitted she didn’t know what it did, but it was the only golf accessory she found that fit her budget. Next, I unwrapped a navy blue golf polo, so I could proudly show off my cup-size like all the other man-boobed golfers who just assumed no one could see their nipples when they wore their polyester-blend polos to the office each and every. Single. Day.

But after buying a hand-me-down pair of clubs from Al at the office, I did have some intention of learning the game. If for anything else so that I could leave the office early—and for days on end—to participate in all the sponsored golf outings. It reminded me of how all the nicotine-addicted coworkers at Pizza Hut got additional smoke breaks while the rest of us were expected to actually work our entire shifts.

As it turns out it probably would have been easier if I just took up smoking.

Al did both things.

He really had life figured out.

He also wore a lot of golf polos to work. And yes, I could always see his nipples.

●●●

I asked an old classmate to teach me how to swing a club. He had been golfing his entire life and even did it competitively in high school, and he didn’t mind all the range balls I was able to expense on my company credit card. At the end of my first lesson, I had not been infected with anything resembling a love for golf.

Tyler never complained about my lack of progress or all the free lessons I was requesting, but I could sense his enthusiasm waning when he started inviting other friends to join us at the driving range. Without his undivided attention, I asked a guy from church who had an obligation to God to say yes every time someone asked for his help, and the two of us rendezvoused at the same driving range where Tyler had done his best efforts with me.

Michael and I only had one lesson, but I did make sure to show him the new golf pullover my work gave me. He was really impressed. It was high quality and only showed my nipples if you got close.

●●●

I was starting to make contact with the ball—most of the time—well, some of the time—and Tyler gave me a crash course on chipping and putting. But I had yet to play an actual round of golf. Our office participated in a weekly golf league for the American Society of Heating, Refrigeration and Air-conditioning Engineers, and after our installation manager was given a year-long ban due to the time he missed a shot and swung his club above his head and down into the putting green lumberjack-style—we were having trouble filling the required four players each week. I decided my time had come.

Al was against the idea.

Which hurt my feelings.

Which Al didn’t care about.

Despite being a beer league for engineers, people took the ASHRAE golf league pretty seriously. When I ran into an old engineering professor at the driving range, I made a comment about how I had never seen him there. He told me he selected which range he practiced at based on the velocity of the wind flow on that given day. He said, “you know it’s that whole engineering thing, you can never really turn it off.”

Engineers are kind of like that.

Every golfer at the ASHRAE league had a handicap based off their league performance to date. Since I had never golfed in that league, or any league, or in any form—my score wouldn’t be counted that first round and would instead be used to establish my handicap.

After missing the ball entirely on my first tee-shot, I regrouped and made contact on my second swing, hooking it and watching it bounce off the cart path and into a tree line. I hit it again and this time the ball ended up in a tree. Not near a tree. In a tree. About three-feet up, gently nestled in the branches of a pine as if it were the egg in a bird’s nest. I tried swinging my club like a baseball bat at the waist high target, which just made the ball land at my feet after the club head caught the pine needles and shook the entire tree.

The rest of the round went much the same.

In order to keep play moving, there was a maximum score allowed on each hole. Something like seven strokes above par. I was mercy-ruled every single hole and at the end of the round was assigned the maximum allowable handicap. That was the only time I participated in the ASHRAE golf league. I never asked to play again, but I also knew Al would never allow it.

●●●

But I had yet to give up hope. After our Vice President Guenther couldn’t attend the Master’s Golf Tournament due to the untimely death of his mother, he let me take his ticket to escort a couple of customers. I had never watched a golf tournament in my life, on tv or in person, and here I was at Augusta National sitting in the same grandstand as former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and yucking it up with a VP of an engineering firm.

“Hey Chris, check it out. There’s Tom Watson.”

“Ohh yeah, how cool is that. I totally know who Tom Watson is.”

I kept getting invited to fancy-ass golf tournaments. I not only went to the Master’s a second time, I also took customers to the PGA Championship and the US Open. The real one. Not the one for old people. I could talk about golf, even if I couldn’t play golf. And for Christmas that year, my mom bought me a series of golf lessons. By the end of these private sessions I knew what a proper swing felt like, and when I aimed my ball at the driving range, well, it went in that general direction.

I was so thrilled that I accepted an invitation from a customer to go golfing. I told him about my lessons and as we drove back to the clubhouse after the round, he tried to encourage me in my new hobby.

“Chris, that’s great that you’re going to start taking lessons soon. I think you’ll really get a lot out of those. That will help your game a lot.”

Fuck it. Golf is stupid. I don’t like looking at man-boobs enough to be a golfer anyways.

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Oh what I would do for a snowplow to run me over…

But as a devoted Batman fan, I have learned one thing about making a difference in this world: you don’t need super powers if you have buckets and buckets of money.

I have some buckets of money, fewer than I would like, and most of it is in a bank and not in a bucket—but because of this money, I can just pay people to write a book review. They actually read the book, and they send an honest review to you. If your book sucks—and it probably does—you get to read the shitty review ahead of time and choose whether or not to make it public. There are two main services that do this: Kirkus and BookLife.

BookLife is the same as Publisher’s Weekly, except it’s…well…I don’t actually know the difference. And then there is a BookLife Prize, which is a different review, and you might when a prize. But neither are technically Publisher’s Weekly reviews, but the reviews are written by the same people who write the Publisher’s Weekly reviews, and you can pay to have them printed in Publisher’s Weekly, but you can’t call them Publisher’s Weekly reviews, but they are.

So rather than trying to make sense of all this, I just emptied one of my money buckets and ordered a review from both of these services. And then apparently I also bought one from IndieReader. Which I don’t remember doing.

And the reviews are good! How about that!

•••

Here they are:

Kirkus:1

•••

BookLife by Publisher’s Weekly:2

•••

The BookLife Prize:3

•••

IndieReader:4

•••

So that’s fun.

If you happened to read Loser* and also liked the book, please add your own review to Amazon, Good Reads, or any other places where you can click a number of stars on things. This stuff actually make a big difference when you’re an unknown. Maybe. I don’t really know. But it makes me feel nice.

If you hated the book, don’t worry about leaving a review. Just buy a bunch of copies to give out as white elephant presents next Christmas. Or you can lie. I’m ok with lying.

You should also look at my website for more book info including: author appearances, photos of me with celebrities that didn’t want to take a picture with my book, bad senior photo shoot images, other things people said about my book, pictures of my hockey puck collection, and a link to my book’s Spotify playlist.

www.csbeaty.com

Thank you everyone who has supported my writing thus far! Those little bits of encouragement go a long way.

-Chris (not C.S.)

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November 9^th, 2024

Dear Mr. Fudd,

I was excited to see your latest correspondence. I know your time is precious as you attempt to bless this world with your beautiful words at an unprecedented scale this holiday season. I wish you much success in this endeavor. I hope the residents of Bliss, Idaho or wherever else your messages end up are as grateful as I am for your poetry.

I have some bad news, the bonsai tree stand in the Hobby Lobby parking lot appears to have migrated south for the winter. But don’t despair. I have an update.

The bonsai tree road stand is operated by a man from Houston that goes by the name of “Thunder Kim.” If you’d like to call him, his number is 832-687-7676—he made sure I had it in case I needed any assistance after I purchased a bonsai tree of my own.

I don’t believe Thunder is his real name, he is very Japanese. He imports all of his bonsai trees from Japan to Houston, and then drives them up to Omaha. I asked him why Omaha? To which he laughed, smiled, and nodded in the manner that Japanese people do who do not have a strong command of the English language.

The ages of his bonsai trees ranged from four years to 26 years old. For each year of age that the Japanese juniper had, Thunder charged an additional $10. It felt like a fair deal, and he gave me complimentary care instructions. I made sure to pick up a copy for yourself. I hope you find them helpful, but this is the extent of my bonsai tree knowledge. If you have further questions, I’m sure Thunder wouldn’t mind if you gave him a call.

Much obliged,

C.S. Beaty

•••

While traveling in non-English speaking countries, I love taking photos of poorly translated English instructions. As someone who spent his first year of fatherhood trying to parent in a foreign language, I’m empathetic to the struggle, but seriously. Bad translations are the best.

Just consider the gondola I rode in Guam that could have said, “please remain seated and do not throw anything outside,” but instead chose to instruct me, “Do not change Seat and Dump outside, please.”

Or the sign in the lobby of a Peruvian hotel that read,

Let’s do that your permanency is agreeable and pleasant TAKE CARE YOUR PERSONAL OBJECTS the hotel don’t know responsibility for losses or steal due that we are in public areas. The management

•••

With a subpar translation, the message isn’t just lost, it becomes an entirely new thing. The challenge of piecing together the meaning of the original text becomes its own activity, and as long as the stakes aren’t too high, the act provides an amusing game. Or at least a funny photo.

I learned a lot about bonsai trees when I finally met Thunder Kim the bonsai tree man, but not how to take care of one. Thunder gave me multiple sets of instructions and sold three small vials of “green green liquid plant food,” but the more helpful Thunder Kim tried to be, the less I knew what to do with my new four-year-old Japanese Juniper. Even the cheat sheet that he insisted I take a photo of left me puzzled:

1.) It is good to fully soak the tree in water for the first time. 2 times in the first week only.

2.) Plant food- Mix the plant food with one gallon of water and water 2 times a week.

3.) Rain water- When it’s raining outside. Rainwater is ok to let the tree absorb the rainwater. No more than 2 times a week.

4.) Sun- No sun or very little sun is ok. Is it is ok with a 24 hour light. Normal conditions are ok as well, such as air condition, heater, and animals.

I tried following Thunder’s instructions as best I could. But I couldn’t really understand how to rectify all of those things I wasn’t supposed to do more than two times a week. It kind of seemed like everything was “ok.” This ought to be easy.

I took the tree out to our patio a few times each week. I let it out when it was raining. I took pictures and showed it off to my friends. Things were looking great for my little tree, until I started comparing the current color of the tree to the color from my first photos. The second my four-year-old Japanese Juniper came into my house, it started its gradual death.

It turns out those things are pretty damn hard to take care of. I must not have read the instructions carefully enough.

•••

Frankly, I thought the bonsai tree would last a lot longer and provide a lot more material for Haywood Fudd letters than it did. I imagined it as some ongoing saga, some new hobby I could periodically update Fudd on with all my new bonsai tree knowledge and experiences. But I never really cared about bonsai trees in the first place, and the death of my own tree certainly indicated that. I was always more interested in Thunder Kim, the bonsai tree stand man. It turns out I wasn’t the only one.

Shortly after purchasing and murdering my Japanese Juniper, the Omaha World Herald newspaper ran a story about “the Omaha bonsai guy.” Apparently he had quite the social media following. People seemed more intrigued in him than the art of bonsai trees. Well, most people. Everyone but Noah Lenser, who responded to a Facebook post asking, “where is the bonsai tree guy parked today?” with the specific location of “up your ass.”

Not helpful Noah.

But other than Noah, people loved this “bonsai guy” and his mysterious full-size van filled to the brim with potted plants. Full-sized vans tend to get a bad reputation given the improper conduct people seem to do in full-sized vans, but now we all had a usage of the vehicle we could get behind. Thunder Kim’s small business was so popular that the Omaha World Herald re-ran the story in its Best of 2025 year-end recap.

But like the dead stump I now use for decor in my basement, my interest in bonsai trees atrophied. It was just as well. Fudd had also seemed to move on to new topics. His next letter to me was his own recap of the year in the form of a Christmas card.

The message, albeit odd, made complete sense to me.

•••

Dear Yuletide You,

If there are burn marks on this jolly dispatch, consider the scribbling source. Consider this too: mailing Christmas cards is teetering on the cheerless precipice of extinction. Some velvety synonyms for extinction include kaput, pfft, defunct, belly up, and doomed.

Everyone is jim-dandy. Sing it: Jim Dandy to the rescue... Jim Dandy to the rescue.

Our granddaughter made her majestic appearance on November 7. She’s also beautiful and breathtakingly perfect. Watching her sleep and listening to her make muffled cooing noises while she’s nuzzled in our arms is pure bliss.

In April, a sinful tornado with oodles of scabby intentions and credentials mauled our town. While others judiciously sheltered in basements, I fortified myself with a beaker of general anesthesia and charged outside to do battle with this swirling tempest. With the wind and rain horse-whipping me, I shook my fist at the man-eating cyclone while baptizing it with a bona fide and virtuous cussing.

Our travels caused us to mosey like insubordinate tumbleweeds and to sideswipe into some of you in 2024. Boosting to get back on the road, we are reposing in Palm Springs during Christmas week with cousin Hunky Gordy where we’ll zigzag through the hidey-holes and haunts of old blue eyes. We return from Palm Springs for four days before bulging to San Antonio where Mrs. Fudd will conduct high-stakes business and I’ll serve as an impromptu tour guide at the Shrine of Texas while stashing myself inside my deteriorating gorilla suit.

We visited a couple of potential sanctuaries in 2024 where we were considering relocating. City ambassadors of two of these cozy communities extended invitations to Mrs. Fudd but not to me. During meetings with these emissaries I couldn’t resist the immaculate temptation to puff on an ill-bred cigar, wear knockoff Elvis sunglasses, sport a sleeveless threadbare T-shirt with a fading picture of Farrah Fawcett emblazoned on it, while randomly issuing strangled grunts of muddling questions and blurry testimonials.

In the ladylike town of Bliss, Idaho (population 300), a disheveled cluster of glassy-eyed, hidebound literary adrenaline junkies anointed me to once again chaperone them to literary Shangri-La. What this de-facto hooey means: I remain The King of the Literary Daredevils. Mrs. Fudd isn’t ohh so amused.

Merry Christmas and Much Obliged,

Haywood Fudd

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October 16th, 2024

Dear Mr. Fudd,

It’s getting colder, which means that I am in the midst of the thankless job of gradually ripping out all of the plants in my wife’s garden and placing them in our garbage bin. It’s about a two-month process since I refused to purchase those large brown paper sacks, so I can only properly dispose of one garbage bin of garden at a time. I could probably start the process earlier in the year since my wife inevitably loses interest in said garden around mid-June, which annually coincides with when there are vegetables that require something to make use of. Some people use vegetables, we let them sit on our counter for the duration of the summer and leak vegetable goo down the kitchen drawers and onto the hardwood floor. It’s an odd hobby, but it seems to make my wife happy. Me, not so much.

Last year I attempted to plant my own herbs to capture some of the thrill my wife seems to enjoy with witnessing the gradual birth and death of an object, so I bought a lemon verbena plant. I don’t know what one does with lemon verbena, but I heard about it in a book once. It’s a plant that smells like lemon. I know what you’re thinking, “you’re just talking about lemons.” I’m not. Lemon verbena, it’s like lemons, but without the lemons. Gradually the plant lost its lemon scent, which I felt was odd, but I was new to gardening. I attempted to make a syrup out of the enormous plant, but it tasted awful and took forever. While I was in the process, my mother came by the house and informed me that I was in fact, not making a syrup out of lemon verbena, but a common garden weed. How was I supposed to know? I had taken good care of the weed though, I was rather proud of it.

Much obliged,

C.S. Beaty